Transcript/650: July 17, 2003

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Where do you.

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Where do you.

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Knowledge Fight.

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Damn. And, Jordan, I'm sweating.

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Knowledgefight.com.

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It's time to pray.

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I have great respect for Knowledge Fight.

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I'm sick of imposing as if they're the good guys saying we are the bad guys.

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Knowledge Fight.

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Dan and George.

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Knowledge Fight.

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Riddle Earth.

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Riddle Earth.

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Riddle Earth.

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Need.

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Need money.

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Riddle Earth.

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Riddle Earth.

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Andy and Kansas.

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Andy and Kansas.

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Andy and...

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Stop it.

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Andy and Kansas.

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Andy and Kansas.

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Andy and...

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It's time to pray.

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Andy and Kansas, you're on the air.

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Thanks for holding us.

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Hello Alex, I'm a fifth-time caller.

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I'm a huge fan.

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I love your work.

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Knowledge Fight.

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Knowledge Fight.

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Knowledge Fight.

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Knowledge Fight dot com.

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I love you.

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Hey everybody, welcome back to Knowledge Fight.

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I'm Dan.

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I'm Jordan.

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We're a couple dudes.

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We like to sit around, worship at the altar of Selene and talk a little bit about Alex

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Jones.

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Oh, indeed we are.

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Dan?

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Dan?

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Jordan.

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Quick question.

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What's up?

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What's your bright spot?

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My bright spot today, Jordan, is I was hanging out with my friend, Angela Lampsbury, and

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she gave me a late Christmas present, and there could be no other bright spot than these

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because she made magic cards that, take a look at these and see what you see.

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Oh, wow.

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Some specially designed magic cards.

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Oh, get the fuck out of it.

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Aww.

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We'll put up pictures of these on Twitter, but one of them is you.

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Yes, I'm a broadcasting banshee, which I will take as a compliment.

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Yes, you do damage with a loud yelling tooth.

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Teals damage to target ear equal to the number of plus one, plus one counters on this card.

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Well, that's fair enough.

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There's one that is me.

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Yes.

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Dutch the Discerner.

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Your name is way better than mine.

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We're legendary creatures, and there's also one of Selene, the feline Contessa.

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Ah, the feline Contessa, of course.

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I did tell her that these are all massively overpowered cards.

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Well, you're 2021, so you've got some-

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We both are, because Blackjack.

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Yes, that's true.

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That is true.

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But yeah, it's just so fun.

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That is fantastic.

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It's nice that there's a collection coming together of unique magic cards-

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Truly fantastic.

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That don't exist-

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It really is cool.

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Anywhere else.

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No, you would never, ever have imagined anything like this, and it's incredible to imagine.

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So thank you, Angela Lampsbury.

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We appreciate it, and it's just, what a delight.

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Yes, very much so.

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What about you?

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Well, that now supersedes my bright spot for being my bright spot, so mine is immediately

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no longer a bright spot.

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But what I had before was, I am excited-

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Previously thought to be bright spots.

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Previously on Bright Spots, Horizon Forbidden West, I've downloaded it.

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As we're recording this tomorrow.

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As we're recording this tomorrow, I'm excited.

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I've been looking forward to playing it.

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Zero Dawn was one of my favorites.

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Yeah, it's great.

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Zig, amazing.

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I've been looking forward to this for a while as well.

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Too bad we can't find PS5s.

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So infuriating.

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It's so infuriating.

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We've been looking for a year.

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Yeah, it's bizarre.

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Commodity goods are not supposed to work that way.

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It's not like it's a niche system or something.

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It's Sony.

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It is funny.

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It's nice.

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Before, I would look at a PS2 or a PS3, and I would say, boy, I want one of those because

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I cannot afford it.

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And now I'm like, ooh, I'm in a better place in my life.

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I can get me one of them.

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Can't have it.

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God damn it.

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It's a reality, and the world will not allow it.

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It's the worst.

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So, Jordan, today we've got an episode to do, and we're doing this just to kill some

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time before you can play Horizon.

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Sure.

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Yes, this is all just waiting game for me.

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And so today, I kind of thought about it, and I was like, you know what?

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We've been talking about the present too damn much.

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There's been a lot.

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It's been constant.

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Is Roger Stone OK?

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He needs some money.

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OK.

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It's been a lot of 2022 episodes in a string, and I need a break.

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So I decided to poke around, see what I could find.

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Project Camelot, disappointing.

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Eh.

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Jim Bakker, no good.

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Fair.

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So I went back to the past, 2003.

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OK.

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And unfortunately, there's a string of episodes that are so boring, nothing is happening,

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and it's just a disaster.

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And so we end up having to skip to July 17th.

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The last one we did was the 11th.

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Yes.

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So we're up to the 17th, 2003, before we can find anything that is worth going over.

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But it is so worth going over.

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OK.

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And I feel excited.

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I feel delighted to have this episode.

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There's fun.

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There's meaty stories.

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There's Alex being an idiot.

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And some of it accidentally relates to the present day in ways that I didn't expect.

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Right.

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Because you're a witch.

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Right.

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Which, by the way, is part of my...

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It is one of your powers.

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That's true.

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You're a scary creature human witch, according to this magic card.

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You got it.

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So we'll get down to business on this nonsense, but before we do, let's take a little moment

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to say hello to some new wonks.

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Oh, that's a great idea.

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So first, Steph in the UK, thank you so much.

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You're now a policy wonk.

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I'm a policy wonk.

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Thanks, Steph.

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Thank you.

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Next, Quackers...

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Quackers O'Cools, thank you so much.

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You're now a policy wonk.

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I'm a policy wonk.

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Thank you very much.

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Thank you.

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Next, 2022 Busted.

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Thank you so much.

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You're now a policy wonk.

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I'm a policy wonk.

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Thank you very much.

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Thank you.

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You're now a policy wonk.

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That's spelled A-V-I-K.

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Ah.

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Good spelling of Avrik.

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I like it.

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I don't know how else you would spell Avrik.

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Anyway, you're a policy wonk.

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I'm a policy wonk.

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Thank you very much.

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Thank you.

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Next, Guantanamo Bay, but it's B-A-E.

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B-A-E?

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Yeah.

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Thank you so much.

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You're now a policy wonk.

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I'm a policy wonk.

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Thank you very much.

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And also, I could have seen it being B-A-E-Y, which would have been a very different type

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of Guantanamo.

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That's true.

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That's true.

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And finally, Alex Snowden...no relation.

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Thank you so much.

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You're now a policy wonk.

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You're now a policy wonk.

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Thank you very much.

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What's fun about that is it could be no relation to Edward Snowden, or it could be no relation

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to Alex Jones, because people are sometimes related by first name.

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That is...I've heard him say that.

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Yes.

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Yes.

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I have indefinitely heard him say that.

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Yes.

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So, we're gonna be dealing with this 2003 episode, and I actually think right off the

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jump we kind of have something that relates to the present day, and that is an insistence

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that there's false flags coming.

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Right.

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Former Defense Secretary says that nukes will go off in U.S. cities.

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It's going to happen.

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Of course, he's CFR.

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And hey, they'll love it.

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A nuke goes off in a city, they'll have even more of an excuse to tell you the government's

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your boss and gonna take all your rights for your safety.

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And of course, it won't be North Korea detonating that nuke, folks.

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It will be the shadow government, and out of that, all of their training, all of their

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takeover systems will be activated, and things are going to go downhill very, very quickly.

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Or we could speak out and get involved and blow the whistle inside and outside of government

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and stand up against the military industrial complex and save America.

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The yuppies and the bureaucrats and all of you are in for a rude awakening.

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You can't go on being part of an evil system forever and not have it turn on you.

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And you're all about to find out.

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You've all been finding out individually over time, but you're going to find out on a mass

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scale what your masters think of you and will do to you.

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So we're entering the night circle of hell, ladies and gentlemen, just all the evidence

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is there.

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Twenty years ago.

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Wow.

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Yeah.

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Wow.

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So the prediction here is essentially that there's going to be a false flag, North Korean

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nuke in a U.S. city, and it's going to lead to World War III, which, of course, all happened.

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It probably didn't just because Alex talked about it and stopped the evil globalist plans.

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Well, I mean, it was good because what I've seen is that the yuppies have not yet all

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woken up.

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It doesn't seem like it.

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It was nice of Alex to stop that and protect the yuppies from the, you know, the darkness

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of the real...

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You don't want them to live in the bright, blinding reality.

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All of society is bent towards coddling the yuppies, so why would we allow them to be

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hurt now?

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That's a good point.

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Yeah.

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So I would, like I said, there's a real stretch of boring shit in 2003 in July that I've been

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going through just because it's fun to wade through the past.

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But I heard Alex talking about the World War III nuking of cities, and it's like, eh, that's

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boring too.

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I could leave that aside.

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But when I heard this, I was like, uh-oh, I'm in.

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All right, ladies and gentlemen, coming up in about 12 minutes, we're going to be joined

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by Angela Lipsman's father, headline, Port KOs College Whiz Kid, a 15-year-old Manhattan

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girl whose parents sent her to college instead of high school, has been told by a judge that

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she can't get her associate's degree even though she's got enough credits as city officials

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launch an educational neglect probe against her dad.

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This is a story that is strange that it's existing on Alex Jones' show.

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Right.

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And it's like, oh, there's got to be something here, you know?

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Whatever details that we are given currently cannot be the entirety of this story.

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Absolutely.

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There's got to be more.

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And then also, I'd be lying if I didn't say that this also kind of spoke to me as somebody

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who I dropped out of high school, you know, there's educational youth stuff in my history.

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And so there's a bit of like, ooh, let's see what we got here.

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I would have had a better chance of graduating college if I had skipped high school.

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I wouldn't be surprised about that.

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Yeah.

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And obviously, if this person is taking college classes in high school, it does require getting

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a GED or dropping out in some way.

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You can't just walk in.

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Right.

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And as a GED recipient, I should say, it's less that I dropped out of high school and

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more that I got GED that makes this something that the deep in me speaks to the deep in

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this story.

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Yes, of course.

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So I'm excited to hear about this.

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Let's go.

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But first, Alex has to dwell on how this is a person who's too smart and the system's

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taken him down.

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Boy, the more details we're going to get is going to be bad.

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Yeah.

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So that's the new America, folks.

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You excel, you are punished.

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You're a mindless idiot.

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You're rewarded.

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Harrison Bergeron.

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Child Kidnapping Services is targeting homeschoolers nationwide, nationwide viciously attacking

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them.

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He loves to bar them from spelling bees and from geography bees because they keep winning

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everything.

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Sure.

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I haven't seen a report where it wasn't a homeschooler or someone from private school,

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so they're attacking that viciously.

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I don't know what kind of local spelling bees Alex might be including in his statistics

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here, so I can't really prove that that's bullshit, but what it can do is discuss the

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big national one.

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The largest spelling bee and the one that you've seen televised is the Scripps National

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Spelling Bee.

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That's the one that's the venue in the movie Aquila and the Bee, and of course the documentary

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Spellbound.

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That spelling bee started in 1927, and the first homeschooled winner was Rebecca Seelthun

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in 1997.

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After her, George Thampy- Oh my god, I remember her!

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I'll tell you why.

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Because the Scripps National- I'm sorry, this is too intense a response for the Scripps

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National Spelling Bee.

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No, no, no.

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Put down the gun.

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No, no, no.

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I'm coming for you.

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The only thing that the spelling bee is great for is it was all of the best episodes of

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Cheap Seats, starring the Sklar brothers, and she had just a fantastic episode.

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She was great on the show, she was great, it was amazing.

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Well she was the first homeschooled winner.

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Well congratulations Sean!

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70 years after the Bee started.

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Almost.

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After her, George Thampy and Sean Connolly both won as homeschoolers in 2000 and 2001.

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Then six years later in 2007, Evan O'Doerne won, bringing the total to four homeschooled

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winners in 82 years.

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If Alex wants to talk about who are really dominating the spelling bee game, he should

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talk about students from India.

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They are far and away the most consistent winners in modern time, or in recent years

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of the Scripps Bee.

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The idea that homeschooled children are beating kids who go to public school in all these

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scholastic competitions isn't true, it's just a centerpiece of homeschool propaganda.

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And to be clear, I don't think there's something inherently wrong with making the decision

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to homeschool your child, but I do think it's unhealthy if it's motivated from the sort

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of place that Alex is coming from, where it's like, the schools are evil and indoctrinating

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your kids into globalism and multiculturalism.

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Yeah, usually that's bad.

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That I don't think is a healthy impulse or instinct, but I understand some people have

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more rational reasons for homeschooling.

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Right, like if you were say, a PhD in pedagogy, you would be like, maybe I'm better than this

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elementary school teacher.

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I honestly think that that might be unhealthy too, because it seems to dovetail with your

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narcissism.

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No no no, I think if you are like a PhD in therapy, you should also be your own child's

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therapist.

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That seems, that makes sense.

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Makes most sense to me.

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I'm not here to delineate what is and is not a healthy reason to homeschool, I just know

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that some are not.

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True.

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So, he's got this incredible news, he's got to interview this whiz kid.

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But first, I mean, there's just important other things that must be discussed.

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The news is incredible, but I do have a death threat email, I get these about every week.

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And basically, it says that I'm with Al Qaeda, because I believe in freedom.

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And that the guy says he's in Texas, and if I ever come to Texas, I'm in deep trouble.

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Well, I'm right here in Texas, sir.

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Come on.

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Yeah, come at me.

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Come get me, you know where I live.

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You can even hear the lack of enthusiasm that Alex has about someone threatening to kill

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him in 2003.

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Eh, fine, whatever.

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Not the first.

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It's strange that he feels the need to bring this up, like, really at the top of the show,

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but also the lack of conviction and passion is glaring.

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Yeah.

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I think I want, I'm with Al Qaeda on a shirt and a hand pointing to the person next to

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me.

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Ooh.

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That's what I really want to go through.

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Don't put that up on our merch.

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Absolutely, and I'm going through airport security tomorrow wearing that shirt.

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Just to see what kind of stuff I can shake out, you know?

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Yeah, that's a good idea.

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That's a good idea.

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I encourage this.

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I think it's great.

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So, Alex lists off a bunch of nonsense evidence that the globalists have been trying to dumb

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down the population for the last forever.

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Forever.

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Yeah.

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I was about to...

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And then the proof of it is this Angela Lipsman whiz kid.

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I've read the official U.S. government Senate documents where they say an educated population

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is hard to govern, we need to destroy the thinking process of the American people.

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That's over 100 years old.

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UNESCO plans from the 50s saying that the family's the enemy.

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Must be destroyed.

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Bush, of course, is signing on to that.

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We've had the former head of policy, Department of Education, number two position in the first

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Reagan administration, Charlotte Isderby on.

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She has the official documents where the internal documents, classified documents, where they

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talk about how they want to train the kids to be mindless idiots.

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And you don't see any greater evidence of how they don't want any free minds out there

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than the New York Post.

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They reported on Angela Lipsman who got into college at 11, had a big accredited college.

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Which one?

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And has a 3.8 grade average.

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And they were very proud of her.

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And now the judge got involved and said, you can't have your degree, you didn't go to our

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accredited public school, you didn't go to your government training camp for proper dumbing

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down, and CPS, Child Grabbing Services, has been called in.

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So Alex is lying about the situation with Angela and her diploma, but also all that

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other stuff was nonsense that he was getting into with these documents in UNESCO.

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Sure, sure, sure.

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But we've talked about a lot of that in the past, so I'm just going to leave that to you.

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Oh yeah, let's water off a duck's back on those.

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So with Angela, the basic gist is this.

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Angela had been taking college courses through the Borough of Manhattan Community College

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for the past three years at this point, since she was 11, and she's now 14.

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And she'd earned enough credits to get an associate's degree.

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Apparently there had been some interest from Vassar to have her come continue her education

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there, but she can't because the community college can't give her her associate's degree.

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This is because you can't get a higher level degree without some form of primary degree.

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You can graduate high school and get a diploma, or you can get an equivalence like a GED and

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that works.

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But most states have rules in place that you can't get a GED until the age you would be

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when you would graduate high school.

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And in Angela's case, in New York, you have to be 17.

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This rule is in place for a number of reasons, but it's primarily because socially, a 14

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or 15 year old isn't ready to be in a college setting, generally.

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And even if you're intellectually able to handle the classroom material, it can be dicey.

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Right, we've seen the results of that too many times.

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The burnout is brutal.

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The bare minimum for this is generally 16 years old for GED issuing in states, and that's

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the minimum age in most states that you can drop out of high school, period.

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You can be allowed to do that.

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It's generally seen as a preferred path for a student to skip a grade if they're overachieving

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because the alternatives don't really seem to be super healthy for a child, broadly speaking.

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Plus, when children overachieve this aggressively, it's often a sign that they might be experiencing

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some unhealthy influence from parents, like the equivalent of an academic stage parent.

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And that's something that you don't necessarily want to facilitate as a society.

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You want to have some guard rails in place.

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At the very least, you don't want to encourage it.

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Sure, sure.

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And there are tons of stories that you can find of people like Angela who have studied

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college level courses and gotten credits prior to graduating from high school.

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But typically, you won't be awarded your degree, even if you earn all the credits for it, until

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you have an equivalence of high school.

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It's just pretty consistently across the board how it has to go.

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Yeah, I tried to pull it off.

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They wouldn't let me.

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I got in trouble for it.

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Almost every high school also has advanced placement classes, like AP classes, that you

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can translate to college credit.

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In some cases, you can take the test afterwards.

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What had happened was I had finished all of those.

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And so I had a huge chunk of my schedule that was empty.

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So I convinced them to let me go to the community college and take courses there.

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But I hated those.

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So I found out that you could test out of those classes and get credit for them.

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So like, instead of going to class, like a game, yeah, I just kept taking all these tests

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and getting grades, getting good grades in these classes.

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But I never went.

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So eventually, they found out that I was spending half of my day outside of school doing fuck

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all.

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And they were real mad at me.

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So I wasn't allowed to keep doing that.

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Yeah, it's, again, that's not what society is.

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It's not beneficial to facilitate that, let's say, or however we'd want to phrase it.

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No, I was immediately going to push back on you.

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It's like, they shouldn't be doing that.

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And I remember my story and I was like, no, no, I get it.

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Yeah, that's how it works.

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Good call.

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There's also more to Angela's story and this whole thing than Alex is letting on.

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And we'll get into that as we go along.

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So when we start off, we get this interview going.

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Alex is interviewing her dad, Daniel Lipsman, and she chimes in a couple times.

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But it seems like it's mostly this dude.

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We are joined by Daniel Lipsman and his daughter, Angela Lipsman, and we really appreciate you

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coming on the show today.

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Pleasure to be here.

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So right off the bat, no real red flags.

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And then he starts talking and I got, I got some problems.

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It had everything to do with an arbitrary capricious age requirement for a high school

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diploma that was totally irrelevant to the academic achievement for the diploma.

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Now the college can-

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It is I, or I am the state, Malone's decision reeks of that attitude.

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It appears to me the guy went to law school, became a judge while blissfully ignorant of

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the bill of rights.

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Judges have turned a blind eye-

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Now we've got some red flags.

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Disgraced the justice, the constitution, the judiciary.

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Malone's cynical decision only reinforces Lipsman's first rule of law.

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Law is whatever the judge says it is.

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So he's clearly reading off a script, like a diatribe, and it was really interesting

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to me the way Alex tried to interject and he just steamrolled.

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And then he just quit.

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Yeah.

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That was interesting.

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I don't know if I've ever heard Alex just take an L like that.

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Yeah.

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And then the break music started playing very shortly after that.

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Yeah, so I kind of felt weird about that.

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I've never really seen that kind of behavior from someone who's a guest or calling in.

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So when I look at the totality of evidence I have in front of me and all the information

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I've been able to find, I don't care much for this Daniel Lipsman character.

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It's one thing to support your very intelligent child's pursuit of appropriate education,

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but it's another thing entirely to do what he seems to be involved in.

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For one thing, the whole studying at college at age 11 thing, it appears to have been Daniel's

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idea.

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In a 2011 profile on Angela in the borough of Manhattan Community College's website,

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Angela describes how she got started.

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Quote, my dad had met Makiya McDonald, who was then assistant to the vice president for

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student affairs, and broached the idea of enrolling me in summer courses.

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This was just after she'd graduated fifth grade, and I don't know how that story doesn't

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include I told my dad I really wanted to go to college over the summer, so he contacted

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Ms. McDonald.

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The way it's phrased makes it really seem like this was something that he was motivated

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towards.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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My dad said I was going to community college.

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Yeah, I don't see as much agency from her in the way that she tells the story in that

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profile.

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Yeah, it does sound like my dad went behind my back, talked to this muckety muck, broached

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the idea, and then the next thing I knew, he said I've enrolled you in summer courses

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at the community college.

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And I don't think that you necessarily get the sense that she's super opposed to it or

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anything, but it does seem like he's the caboose.

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It sounds like if you were asking me that question about swimming lessons, I'd be like,

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well, my parents saw an ad in the paper, and then the next thing I knew I was at swimming

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lessons.

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It'd be very similar.

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And when you read this profile, you get a sense that she's an amazingly capable and

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driven person, but also the level of stress and responsibility that was being put on her

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at that age I think is wildly inappropriate.

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From the profile, quote, I went to school every day like everyone else, she says, but

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two evenings a week I took the subway downtown to Chambers Street to attend classes at BMCC.

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When she got home, she'd first tackle her sixth grade homework.

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That was the most challenging part, she admits, but somehow I was able to get enough sleep

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and wake up refreshed the next day ready to do it all over again.

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That sounds not great.

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Oh, man.

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So this would make me a bit weary, but the reality is that this isn't even the first

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time that Daniel Lipsman has used his child to try to bring legal action against the schools.

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In 1999, Lipsman sued the New York City Board of Education because he felt that their uniform

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policy, quote, violates their rights to free speech, equal protection, privacy, and liberty

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under the First, Ninth, and Fourteenth Amendments.

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The judge found his case to have no merit, so Lipsman, acting as the lawyer for himself

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in the case.

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Did you need to say that?

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Did anybody need to hear that he was acting as his own lawyer?

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Well, technically not his own lawyer, we'll get to that in a second, but he waived all

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the claims and the judge gave the school board summary judgment and informed Lipsman that

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if he didn't get an actual lawyer for the case, it would be dismissed.

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He felt like he should be able to represent his daughter pro se, but it's established

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law that you can't appear pro se for someone else.

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You can only do that if you're representing yourself, so he was in the wrong here, couldn't

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do it.

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Yeah, that would violate that everybody's entitled to an attorney kind of thing right

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there.

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And if you're not a lawyer and you're insisting on representing your child, then you're depriving

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them of...

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Exactly.

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They are entitled to a lawyer and you are not one.

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So Lipsman didn't get a lawyer and then decided to appeal the case, arguing that, quote, the

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district court's dismissal of Angela's claims on the ground that she lacked an attorney

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deprived her of her right to a day in court.

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Wow.

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Really taking some swings.

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This guy is a big swinger.

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This appeal would be rejected and the prior dismissal affirmed.

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That this is right around the time that Angela was graduating fifth grade and starting college

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courses.

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Taken together, I can't help but get a little bit of a picture of someone not acting from

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a place of trying to do what's best for his child, but actually more of someone who's

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acting out and using their child as a prop.

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Otherwise, it's hard to understand how he wouldn't get a lawyer to try the case about

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uniforms if that was actually what this was about, like these underlying claims, as opposed

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to like getting a chance to grandstand in front of a court.

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There is a little seeming of, you know, oh, well, you won't let me do this because of

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the dress code?

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Fine, then I'll put my kid into community college.

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That'll show you.

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I can't, you know, I can't demonstrate that in any way, but, you know, the narrative arc

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seems there.

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Yeah, and that guy's an asshole.

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But Daniel's issues go back even further than this.

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Of course.

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I was able to find a New York Times article from 1993 about how New York schools were

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delaying in opening that school year because there was a fear about asbestos, so they were

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doing a thorough investigation before letting kids in.

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Angela was about to begin kindergarten and according to this article, Daniel had taken

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the school board to court to try to force them to open the schools on September 9th,

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ultimately losing that case.

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You could look at this as him having previously been really into schools and then a few years

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later going 180 degrees, but I actually think that this behavior tracks perfectly with his

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later actions.

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He seems to like to sue people, particularly the school board, and I would guess he has

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a fairly libertarian leaning set of politics, so I guess he would probably be super opposed

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to spending money to inspect schools for asbestos.

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Absolutely.

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Red tape, wasted money, and bureaucracy.

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I mean, what?

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The free market should choose whether or not asbestos kills my child.

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There's a weird string here going back to 1993 of him repeatedly suing the school board

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for things that seem a little weird.

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Yeah, I imagine this is a guy who has a card ready and waiting at a security checkpoint,

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just like, you don't have the right to search my car, sir, thank you very much.

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This fight that he's having over the diploma issue is not the first time that he's tried

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to tangle with the school board on his, presumably on his daughter's behalf.

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Right, right, right.

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Theoretically on his daughter's behalf.

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Yes, and that to me is a troubling pattern of behavior.

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Yeah, I mean, you know, I imagine every single person involved when he walks in the door

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went, oh god, this guy.

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So that's not a good place to be.

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I don't want to be that guy.

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Also, I found two pieces of information about Daniel Lipsman that I found shocking.

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One of them I can prove, and the other one is a little bit unclear.

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The unclear...

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He was dead the whole time.

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No.

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Oh, okay.

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The one that's unclear is that I think he wrote a book in 1972 titled The Jewish Connection.

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There's a listing for that book being written by Daniel Gene Lipsman in the Library of Congress's

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catalog of copyright entries, but I can't find the actual book, and I can't 100% confirm

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that this is the same person.

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That is definitely his middle name, though, so it seems like the odds are pretty good.

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And in my experience, if you title the book The Jewish Connection, my eyebrows go up.

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Yeah, and if you are a person suing the school board multiple times for tiki-tak stuff, you're

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the type of person who wrote The Jewish Connection.

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I think that that's, you know, obviously we don't have any access to the book.

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We could be making undue assumptions about it.

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I have no idea.

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Possible.

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But it's strange.

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Take a present.

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Look backwards.

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The thing that I can prove is that in 2020, Lipsman received exactly one vote in the race

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for the 13th district house seat in New York.

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It seems like not too far-fetched to assume that he voted for himself.

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It's a little gauche to vote for yourself.

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Which means that he ended up tying with such illuminaries as Eugene V. Debs, R&B singer

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Keith Sweat, and a misspelling of Cat Williams.

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Wait, so Eugene Debs was dead the whole time?

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Maybe he's dead the whole time.

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I don't know.

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Maybe.

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So actually there's a second vote, a write-in vote, for Daniel J. Lipsman.

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So he might have actually gotten two write-in votes.

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I think that might have been him.

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I think he accidentally misspelled his own name on his vote.

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Which means that he beat Keith Sweat, and he tied with TV's Jon Stewart.

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Ooh, so close.

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Yeah.

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Point is, I get the sense that this guy's not really acting above board, and there's

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a part of me that feels bad for Angela.

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No one under 18 should have literally any exposure to Infowars, particularly not being

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interviewed on it, and being used to create anti-public school propaganda the way this

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is being done.

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Yeah.

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I found that to be shitty.

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Every part of this sucks for her only.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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In the end, their interview is boring, so we're not going to look at it too much.

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But this incredibly fucked up thing did end up happening that just baffled me.

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Real quick, do you have an email address for folks that might want to contact you?

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Angela, do you have your email address?

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Uh, yeah.

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Okay.

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Don't.

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Would you like to give it out?

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Don't.

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Don't.

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I mean, you don't have to, I'm just saying people might send you guys some federal ruling

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statements.

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Well, no, the problem, Alex, is that she shares it with two other kids, and they may not want

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to.

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Oh, I understand now.

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That's good instincts on Angela's part.

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I can't imagine how Alex couldn't realize that giving out the contact information for

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a 14-year-old on his show might be a super inappropriate thing for him to do.

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But not to be outdone by Alex's completely insane action, Daniel pops in and says this

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that blew my fucking mind.

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Well, if folks want to get a hold of you, I'm sure they can find out how to do it.

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I can give my address, though.

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I don't mind that.

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Okay, go ahead.

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It's Daniel Lipsman, L-I-P-S-M-A-N, 4420, 4420.

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Yeah, so he ends up giving out their home address, complete with apartment number.

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Wow!

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That's just not fucking cool at all.

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Uh, pfft.

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Wow.

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Yep.

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Wow.

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I don't know what kind of, like, nobody's listening to this show-ass feeling they must

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have had to be able to, like, oh yeah, this is safe.

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I mean, Jesus Christ.

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I feel like he's got a copy of Catcher in the Rye on him at all times.

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That kind of...

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I can't imagine dodging the bullet of, like, oh shit, we almost gave out a child's email

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address.

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And then, let's give out her real address.

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Yeah.

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Oh my god.

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She doesn't share that with two other little girls, so...

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So this whole thing got resolved when Angela turned 16 and went to New Jersey, where she

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could get a GED at 16 as opposed to waiting until she was 17 in New York.

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She got her degrees and ended up pursuing a path in law, and as far as I can tell, she's

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a practicing attorney now.

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So good for her.

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I imagine she represented herself during the Emancipation.

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Unfortunately, this fingerprint still remains of this episode of Alex Jones' show where

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this story was told and, you know, I'm glad that she landed on her feet, though, and seems

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to be alright.

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I bet she is absolutely dynamite at Two Truths and a Lie.

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Her Two Truths and a Lie game must be out of this world.

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It's just three things that her dad sued the school board for, and one is made up.

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Nuts.

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Yep.

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So, uh, Alex is just, like, really, really, like, come on.

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Come on.

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Wait until you're 17, 16, to get a GED.

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It's nonsense.

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Now, Albany Supreme Court Justice Bernard Malone ruled Monday that because she's not

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17, Angela is too young to obtain a high school equivalently diploma.

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There's people in Texas, I know, that are 13 that get it.

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That's ridiculous, if you can take the test and pass it and get out of the system, why

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not?

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Yeah, that's not true.

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Alex probably thinks that because he feels like Texas is a common sense freedom state

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that you can't, you know, get a GED whenever you want.

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Yeah, it feels like you're freer in Texas than you are in other states.

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Yeah, yeah, but you have to be 16.

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Yeah.

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So you're not freer.

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Uh-uh.

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Oh, okay.

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So that guest was really interesting, and obviously I really enjoy digging in and trying

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to figure out what the real story is.

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Yeah, you clearly had a great time with that one.

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Yeah, these 2003 episodes obviously offer a lot more variety in terms of those things.

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I usually am not blessed with multiple instances of this in one episode, but Angela and her

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dad was one story, and Alex has another guest that's like, holy shit, this sounds like it's

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going to be amazing.

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Coming up eight minutes into the next hour, we have a Dr. David Race Bannon coming on.

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Race Against Evil, the secret missions of the Interpol agent who tracked the world's

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most sinister criminals.

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I don't really know what to say about this whole story because what I think of Interpol

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and what I know about the UN and who's involved in a lot of the crimes listed in this book,

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but we'll find out with the guest.

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This should be interesting.

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It's fascinating.

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This is very exciting.

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Yeah, I feel like you can buy guest spot territory while we're selling your book or the like.

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So this guy, he did name himself after Race Bannon from Johnny Quest.

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I was wondering, I wanted to be sure, I wanted to be sure, but yes.

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I can confirm that.

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Okay.

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Yes, he's written a book called Race Against Evil, and so-

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Colon Race Colon Against Evil.

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He's gotten a little bit of press about this.

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He's an Interpol agent who has a really, really extreme story about going around Europe and

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killing people who are involved in the human trafficking and child exploitation ring.

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And Alex is a little bit ambivalent about this because he believes that Interpol is

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actually engaging in the trafficking itself.

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And so he's having a difficult time squaring this, but he's going to interview Race Bannon.

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No one is ready for this.

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Okay.

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I'll tell you that right now.

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All right.

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I believe you.

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And Alex isn't either because he's got to go to some calls.

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And there's a theme in these calls.

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Dave in California, in Northern California, welcome.

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Howdy, Alex.

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Hello, Dave.

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I just wanted to congratulate you on your excellent interview with Ann Coulter last

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week.

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The level of discourse I heard from her is a good example of the dumbing down of America

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that you're discussing right now.

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It's a babbling neo-con.

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Yes.

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And mainly I just wanted to tell you that I was thrilled to hear her honking and flapping

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like a goose that's been run over by a truck.

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Yeah.

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There's a real trend.

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I think that most of the calls that he gets are about how he destroyed Ann Coulter.

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I don't recall that.

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I don't either.

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But- I don't recall her flapping and honking like

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a goose either.

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Really?

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I recall her laughing at how stupid this was.

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Yes.

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And that this is LaRouche shit.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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I mean, I didn't know geese laugh, but perhaps that's taught me a lesson.

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Yeah.

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I don't recall.

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And guess what?

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It's about the same thing.

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Bill in Wisconsin.

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You're on the air worldwide.

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Go ahead.

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Yeah, Alex.

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I just want to agree with the last caller there.

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You did a tremendous job on her.

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I just can't stand her.

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She really thinks she's something and you did a job.

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She said, she said, I haven't read the Patriot Act.

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I said, well, I'm going to read you a subsection.

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No.

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I go, but you wrote in your book about how it doesn't take our rights and how we're liars.

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That's not what she said.

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No.

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No.

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No.

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But yeah.

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Neither on his show nor in the book.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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There's a, there's a real interesting, I mean, it's misogyny, really.

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Yeah.

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Absolutely.

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100% misogyny.

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There is a real thread of that.

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Like in the larger calls of like resentment towards this woman who thinks she knows things.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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It's, it's strange, but it's not too unexpected.

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And I think one of the things that you really noticed about this is that Ann Coulter is

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legit.

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She's mainstream relevant.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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And so there's a preoccupation with, and like an obsession with continuing the conversation

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about her long after that interview happened and like sort of

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Seem to get some aftershocks of attention on the earthquake of the original interview.

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And find ways to remold it and reshape it into like this heroic story that Alex vanquished

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Medusa or whatever.

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Right.

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And it would not surprise me to discover that most of the time when Alex is easily dismantled

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by a woman, a group of men get around him to gather and say that he's so great and he's,

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he won.

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He's the best.

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There's no way a woman would ever defeat any of us.

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It was so amazing how you yelled cupcake drunkenly at that woman at the woman's march.

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Oh my, you're just a hero.

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You really proved your points.

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Men are better.

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Yeah.

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So Alex gets to introducing Dr. David Race Bannon and he reads the excerpt or like the

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little blurb of his book.

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And I got to say, Alex could not sound more bored.

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Let me just read some of the excerpts now or the description of race against evil, the

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secret mission of the Interpol agent who tracked the world's most sinister criminals.

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And this electric narrative of suspense and intrigue delivers a firsthand account of heinous

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criminals and stern justice from the insider's view of David Race Bannon.

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The age of 19, the American youth is recruited by Interpol after he is caught in a deadly

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riot in South Korea.

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Over the next 15 years, Bannon is trained to work in the darkest regions of humanity,

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deny society's inhibitors against killing and embrace the agency's role as deliverer

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of grim justice to evildoers beyond the reach of the law.

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His assignments take him from the slave houses of Thailand and the disappearance of London's

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most notorious child pornographer who investigating the KAL 858 bombing and tracking tariffs and

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criminals in the United States.

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And it's an interesting book that is so late.

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I even yawned in the middle of that.

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This is a sleepy, bored reading of this, what should be, like that's high intrigue.

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I mean, it sounds like a movie, so I imagine it's probably not as true as we would like

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it to be.

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I mean, who knows?

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This guy, I mean, he's named after a Johnny Quest character.

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See, that's a red flag.

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Pretty legit.

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The issue being recruited at 19 after being caught at a South Korean riot, that one raises

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some red flags to me.

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Sure.

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That story is actually fairly interesting.

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He was at a riot in South Korea, like a student uprising, and he got stabbed by some guy,

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and so he ended up having to kill him.

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And then Interpol recruited him.

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Right.

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They were really impressed with...

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With the way he murdered that guy at 19.

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Interpol is like, whoa, that's a good murderer.

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Yeah, they're scouting at riots.

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Now I'm gonna say that sounds far-fetched, but now that I hear it...

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I think he'll tell a little bit more of the details of that story later, so we'll get

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to that when he gets to it.

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All right.

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But yeah, so he got recruited in, and he became part of this unit called Archangel that goes

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around and it deals with these human traffickers.

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Uh-huh, there's Minerva.

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Well, just tell us the story and tell us about yourself and what happened.

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Oh, sure.

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And I wouldn't say Interpol was the good guy, far from it.

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However, certainly the sub-directorate of Interpol for which I worked, Archangel, our

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job was to identify those who buy and sell children across international lines.

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Having said that, you've mentioned previously a couple of times, a very good point, for

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most listeners, it's difficult to wrap our brains around this type of crime.

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So you see there him being, like, deferent to Alex's point, because Alex's main sticking

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point is gonna be like, hey- Interpol is evil, and he's like, yeah, Interpol

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is totally evil.

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Yeah, yeah.

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But not my part.

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Nope.

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I'm dope.

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Yeah, which I think is smart.

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Yeah, absolutely.

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That's a good way to placate Alex's concerns.

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He's not gonna come with too many hard questions if you concede to his main point right out

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of the gate.

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He's gonna keep having cake if he can't eat it.

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Right, right.

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So I think one of the things that I'd like to do as an experiment is sort of, you know,

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I want you to experience this information and see what you think about it.

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Okay.

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Are there red flags?

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Right.

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And you already had one that's Ray Spanner.

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Sure, that one's trouble.

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Yeah.

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But we're gonna begin the story at the beginning, and we're gonna go through all the way to

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the end.

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And we're gonna go piece by piece to see what is true and what's not true.

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Well, I mean, we can't really know that at this point, but I just want you to have your

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instincts.

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Gotcha.

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Like, as somebody who takes in information and assesses it, how do you feel?

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Right now, this guy sounds like a cold-blooded killer.

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All right.

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And we'll go on to this next clip where Alex is really trying to nail this part down that

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is like, sure, there are people out there who are running human trafficking and what

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have you.

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And every time I look into it, it's my enemies who are doing it.

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Sure.

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Isn't that weird?

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Yeah.

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And so let's see if Bannon agrees.

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Okay.

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So what I'm saying is every time I track it back, it's the UN, it's major corporations,

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and then there are federal agencies and other agencies that are trying to stop it, but they

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always get called off of it when they get too high up the chain.

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Exactly correct.

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My years with Interpol, when we were assigned to track these individuals, many times we

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would find with any network of the slavery rings, there are individuals highly placed,

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either religious or political leaders or people of old money, and very seldom were those individuals

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our targets.

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Instead, we would target people lower down the chain.

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And then it really becomes, in an overarching system, an intelligence system so the elite

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knows how close other agencies are getting to what they're doing.

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That is correct.

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Hmm.

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Well, problem number one is very simple.

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If you are in control of your story, why are you agreeing with absolutely random and sane

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things Alex is saying?

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Mm-hmm.

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Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (00:43:36.079)

I mean, if your story was true, wouldn't you say true things instead of being like, Alex,

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you got it exactly right.

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Unless that is part of his true story.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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It's not necessarily to say that Alex bringing this up is forcing him to change his story.

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You haven't read his book.

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That's true.

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That might actually be part of his life story.

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Right.

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So you have the construction, though, of this guy is an insider.

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He worked at Interpol in this agency.

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Archangel.

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Yeah, Archangel.

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And he has experienced that Interpol is essentially just a cover-up operation protecting these

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really rich and powerful people while taking out lower-level folks.

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See, now, he didn't say that.

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Well, that's what was said.

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That's what was said.

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Yeah.

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And then he said, exactly right, Alex.

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Right.

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That I have a problem with.

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I don't think, I mean, my sense of it from the fuller interview is I don't think that

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he would not say that.

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What wouldn't he say?

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Well, he would say that he's killed a lot of people.

Unknown Speaker (00:44:41.760)

Yeah, well.

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I do believe that there are a lot of people in Interpol who wanted this terrible traffic

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to stop and were doing everything they could to stop it, but I also know that frequently

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we were not assigned the cases where it was very clear an individual of significant influence

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was either buying and selling child pornography or actually involved in purchasing the services

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of child prostitutes.

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Unbelievable.

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Now you would assassinate these people.

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The teams with Archangel, known as Cleaners, were, in essence, assassination teams, yes.

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And I guess we'll talk about that when we get back, but how did you get into this?

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That's really, I guess, where the story should start.

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Oh, sure.

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Do we want to talk about that when we get back?

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We've got a few minutes right now.

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I just wanted to warn you of that, but yeah.

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How did this start?

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Well, I started as a Mormon missionary in South Korea, of all things.

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Oh, boy.

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So, yeah, he's an assassin.

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Okay.

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How are you feeling?

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You ever see Bloodsport?

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You know how that's-

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Dukes?

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Frank Dukes?

Unknown Speaker (00:45:52.960)

Yeah, Frank Dukes.

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You know how that's a true story?

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Based on a true story?

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It definitely is.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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I'm getting a lot of Bloodsport vibes from this right now.

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Kumite.

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I'm getting a lot of kumite vibes.

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I'm getting a lot of, the military had to let me go fight in this underground tournament

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because I was too good for them to get in the way of, but they had to keep tabs on me

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because I'm too good.

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What if I fight against the whole government?

Unknown Speaker (00:46:15.599)

Well, yeah, that's interesting you have those vibes.

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I'm having those vibes right now.

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It's totally understandable that you would because this story is wild.

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Yeah.

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Yeah, so he's part of an assassination team.

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I think that there's a strange trend in some of these guests that Alex has that they like

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to portray themselves as hitmen.

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Larry Nichols has claimed that he killed people for the coins.

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Of course.

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Hard rice, soft rice.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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But it's, yeah, I don't understand why these folks just insist on playing up murder credentials.

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I don't know.

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I don't know.

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Whether true or not, because we know in Larry's case it was bullshit.

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He admitted that he lied about that, whereas in this case this guy still might have been

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an actual cleaner.

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Right.

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Right.

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I don't know too many people who, I mean, you know, I don't know too many people who've

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killed anybody.

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Well then also we gotta add Alex himself to the list.

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Sure.

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He's bragged about killing people.

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Yeah.

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Do you, do people look up to you if you kill a lot of people?

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I don't know.

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I think it's just one, I think it's a machismo thing.

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Yeah.

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Being menacing, scaring people as part of their masculinity.

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See, I mean, I feel like every person I've ever met and known who has killed anybody

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though has been like, killing people is not something to ever say ever.

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How many people have you met who have killed people?

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Two.

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Soldiers?

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Well, yeah, yeah.

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Okay.

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I mean my grandfathers both fought in the, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Unknown Speaker (00:47:37.960)

That makes much more sense.

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That makes way more sense than like the other couple of days I was out at a bar and somebody

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was like, yay, I got medals and shit.

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No, no, no.

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Both of them were very much like, not something to brag about.

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I think that you hear that typically in interviews and stuff with people who have been in the

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service.

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Actually done it.

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Yeah.

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So yeah, this story begins for him in South Korea in this riot and he'll discuss that

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here a little bit.

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Well, I started as a Mormon missionary in South Korea of all things and got involved

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in a riot in South Korea at the time as a very war-torn country.

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Some 2,500 students were killed during that riot and I was required to use lethal force

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to defend myself.

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My actions came to the attention of an Interpol recruiter and it was just convenient for him

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to have somebody who had Korean language training and was malleable to their propaganda techniques

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as many fundamentalist Christians are.

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And that's why they use the brotherhood out of DC to recruit a lot of people young.

Unknown Speaker (00:48:40.159)

Oh, sure.

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Of course.

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And fundamentalist Christian college campuses are without a doubt the primary recruitment

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ground for most intelligence agencies.

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The reason being that if you have someone young and naive who will equate service to

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God with service to country, you can get them to do anything.

Unknown Speaker (00:48:56.719)

Oh man, that whole thing about marrying fundamentalist service to God with a form of patriotism?

Unknown Speaker (00:49:01.480)

Yeah.

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And how you can get people to do just about anything?

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Can't help but feel like that has heavy resonance with Alex's present day career.

Unknown Speaker (00:49:07.519)

No, I can't think anything about that.

Unknown Speaker (00:49:09.400)

That seems like exactly what he does.

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Instead of getting people to do things in service to their country, he just gets them

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to buy pills.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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It's a little bit different.

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It's a little, I mean.

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The mentality is pretty much the same.

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He's just basically describing Alex's business model.

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Wet religion with, yeah.

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I'm getting, I'm feeling like if he weren't recruited by Interpol, he would have been

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recruited by the secret space program.

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I'm getting like all of the recruiters for various-

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Getting a lot of Camelot vibes here?

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Yeah, I'm getting a lot of all the recruiters for various places were all at that particular

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riot.

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They were kind of looking around and he just got nabbed by Interpol first.

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He was about to be a super soldier and he doesn't even know how much he missed out on.

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All of these groups, like the secret space program, Interpol, globalists, all of them

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were there for like a convention.

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And the riot itself was actually just like a recruitment thing.

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They were all watching with binoculars.

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Absolutely.

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Like it's a squid game.

Unknown Speaker (00:50:10.039)

Yeah, it's exactly a squid game.

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They squid gamed until people became soldiers.

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Yep, that makes sense.

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So Alex wants to ask about like how, how many people have you killed?

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Like you're talking about being an assassin.

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How many people have you killed?

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We were then given a dossier on this individual and assigned either as a team or singly to

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track this individual and extract as much information as possible from them either through

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undercover work or sometimes through torture and then ultimately eliminate them.

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How many people did you torture and kill, doctor?

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If I may dodge that question, I will answer this, the head of Archangel, commissioner

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Jacques Daffaire with Interpol told me that of the some 250 Archangel cleaners or assassins,

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most of them were responsible for into three digits.

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Three digits?

Unknown Speaker (00:51:07.239)

Yes, sir.

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Sure.

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But that's, that, I mean, but you look at the BBC and Reuters, I mean, Dime Corps in

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the UN, 200,000 people flown out, the women and children, I mean, how big is this?

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I mean, this is, this is amazing.

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It is amazing.

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It is of huge global proportions.

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The money that is generated is into the billions of dollars.

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So he's killed hundreds of, into the hundreds of people?

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That's the type of thing where somebody's like, see, this is so crazy.

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They'll have to believe it.

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There's no way anyone would believe that I would lie about that many.

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It's too obvious that I'm lying.

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That's why they'll buy it.

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I'm getting a strong sense that you've, you've tracked this.

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You've marked this as bullshit.

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I am pretty close to saying definitively, this is complete bullshit.

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See, these instincts that you have- It's in the three digits, all of the cleaners

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for the Interpol.

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250 or so of them have three digit killed numbers.

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Three digit.

Unknown Speaker (00:52:10.519)

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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That's a lot of people.

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That's a lot of people.

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That's a lot of targeted assassination missions.

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So you're telling me that these people are important enough to be assassinated, but not

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important enough for anybody to notice that thousands of them are going missing all the

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time?

Unknown Speaker (00:52:25.400)

No, it's probably covered up by Interpol.

Unknown Speaker (00:52:26.400)

Oh, that makes sense.

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So yeah, you have, you know, just the basic gist of this story is already giving you massive

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red flags.

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The South Korean riot that leads to being recruited by Interpol, where he ends up becoming

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part of a program called Archangel, where he's killed into the hundreds of people.

Unknown Speaker (00:52:47.199)

It just, it's a little fantastical.

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I'm getting close to what is going to be my favorite part of the story, which is the part

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where they have to explain why their evil organization that has directed them to murder

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thousands of people will absolutely not harm them whatsoever after leaving and revealing

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all of those secrets.

Unknown Speaker (00:53:05.719)

Well, I think it's obvious and that will come up.

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Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (00:53:09.840)

Oh, I know.

Unknown Speaker (00:53:10.840)

There's going to be an explanation for it and I'm looking forward to it.

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There's already an explanation too that is unspoken, but I found this in looking into

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him into why Interpol won't say that he actually was an agent and that's because of course

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they wouldn't.

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Why would they?

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Why?

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They'd never reveal that.

Unknown Speaker (00:53:25.760)

What?

Unknown Speaker (00:53:26.760)

No.

Unknown Speaker (00:53:27.760)

This time, no.

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Perfect.

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Yeah.

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So look, one of the big things that Alex wants to really nail down in terms of this interview

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is that they're ignoring the upper level people like the globalists.

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They get a pass from Interpol.

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I mean, they're not saying Rothschild's, but that's basically the vibe that I'm getting

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from him.

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When he says old money, that's what I'm feeling.

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You might make that assumption.

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What really runs this?

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What does it lead back to?

Unknown Speaker (00:53:55.559)

Well, ultimately it comes down to money as almost all of these pernicious rings do.

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The producers themselves had to have customers.

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When we were able to extract information from the producers, frequently they would name

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more powerful people who were funding their activities and who were purchasing much of

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the material as well as purchasing the children themselves.

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Some of the names that we were given, we would deliver to our commissioner and never here

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again.

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And they were names of people that are infamous in the world for their either political, monetary

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or religious influence.

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Wow.

Unknown Speaker (00:54:37.320)

Yeah.

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That's just incredible to see this going on.

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Wow.

Unknown Speaker (00:54:44.119)

This is exactly what I've made up stories about for a long time.

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And now you're telling me that all of it's true.

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This is overwhelming.

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Alex is not doing the work to sell this.

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But he's also not doing the work of the sort of, I don't know, critical analysis of the

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information that's coming in that even you're not doing.

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The baseline of, are you serious?

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He's just accepting all of this.

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It really feels like he's just trying to get this guy to finish his story and then get

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him off the air.

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He's just going constantly.

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He's just like, wow, that's amazing.

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He's on for the rest of the show.

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Get the fuck out.

Unknown Speaker (00:55:19.039)

No.

Unknown Speaker (00:55:20.039)

Why?

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Alex is thrilled.

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This is bullshit.

Unknown Speaker (00:55:23.039)

Alex is thrilled by this.

Unknown Speaker (00:55:24.039)

How?

Unknown Speaker (00:55:25.039)

Well, it's because it feeds into the narratives that Alex already has in place, namely that

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they're going around, they're finding these people and then they're using Interpol as

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a way to cover up these rich and powerful people and that then those rich and powerful

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people are being blackmailed in order to do exactly what the globalists want them to.

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We then were encouraged to infiltrate the network just basically doing standard undercover

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work.

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We would develop a complete legend or cover story and get as much information as possible

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before we ultimately eliminated our targets, sometimes using torture if necessary.

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While we were doing this, we often would uncover many names within the network that were not

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known to us, just low-level producers again all across the world and occasionally a name

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would pop up that was immediately recognizable or upon further research we could see was

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highly placed within a government, within a religious organization or some major global

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corporation.

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Were you allowed to go after those people?

Unknown Speaker (00:56:27.280)

Not once.

Unknown Speaker (00:56:30.840)

That's amazing.

Unknown Speaker (00:56:31.840)

No way.

Unknown Speaker (00:56:32.840)

Again, it was an intelligence bureau for those in the establishment that were doing this

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to insulate themselves.

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Just talking around the warehouse where we trained at Archangel, talking with some of

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our supervisors, et cetera, we do know that there were occasionally times when these individuals

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were blackmailed with the information that we had uncovered to suit the current agenda

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of Interpol.

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So this all works perfectly for Alex.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:00.840)

Right.

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He likes this.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:02.840)

This is great.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:03.840)

I get it.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:04.840)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:05.840)

Come on.

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Come on.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:07.840)

Are you telling me that Interpol is in the business of blackmailing world leaders?

Unknown Speaker (00:57:10.679)

Sure.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:11.679)

Why?

Unknown Speaker (00:57:12.679)

Why is Interpol doing it?

Unknown Speaker (00:57:14.119)

Right?

Unknown Speaker (00:57:15.119)

Isn't that our first question?

Unknown Speaker (00:57:19.159)

Ultimately at the end of the day, Interpol does not exercise a lot of power in the global

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structure.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:24.639)

No, that's not the first question.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:25.639)

Oh, okay.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:26.639)

It might be your first question.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:27.639)

It's a question.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:28.639)

It's not really even a relevant question for this interview.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:30.400)

Sure.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:31.400)

That's fair.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:32.400)

Far more relevant.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:33.400)

Let's talk some more about those assassinations.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:34.400)

How'd you kill those people?

Unknown Speaker (00:57:36.519)

Okay.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:37.519)

God damn it.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:38.519)

Now, just an average, you know, committing hundreds of assassinations, on average assassination,

Unknown Speaker (00:57:45.199)

how would that play out?

Unknown Speaker (00:57:46.840)

Well, each assassination team, a team of cleaners, usually was three or four individuals.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:53.039)

Sometimes we were sent out singly or in teams.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:56.000)

The teams had their own strengths and weaknesses.

Unknown Speaker (00:57:59.639)

My particular forte was what's known as close wet work.

Unknown Speaker (00:58:03.360)

That is close quarter combat using hands or bladed weapons.

Unknown Speaker (00:58:07.239)

You're walking up and stabbing somebody in the neck or head.

Unknown Speaker (00:58:12.079)

Yes.

Unknown Speaker (00:58:13.079)

And the methods.

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Basic special forces type stuff.

Unknown Speaker (00:58:15.480)

Yes, yes, absolutely.

Unknown Speaker (00:58:17.519)

And the methods that we used were designed to eliminate the person quickly and quietly.

Unknown Speaker (00:58:23.760)

There were other methods used, of course, and they were in the visual success of the

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people.

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Ever sabotaged vehicles or was that not sure enough?

Unknown Speaker (00:58:33.639)

That is definitely not sure enough.

Unknown Speaker (00:58:34.960)

Yes, this guy's a master in knives.

Unknown Speaker (00:58:37.440)

I was proficient in the size.

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Other people in my group had...

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Katana?

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With swords.

Unknown Speaker (00:58:44.480)

A bow staff?

Unknown Speaker (00:58:45.480)

There was a bow staff, of course.

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A nunchuck guy?

Unknown Speaker (00:58:48.039)

There was a nunchuck guy, but he was a little bit out there.

Unknown Speaker (00:58:50.880)

He was a party dude.

Unknown Speaker (00:58:51.880)

He had a lot of fun.

Unknown Speaker (00:58:52.880)

I'm telling you, you know what?

Unknown Speaker (00:58:54.460)

On those long road trips, he would keep us laughing.

Unknown Speaker (00:58:57.400)

He was a good guy.

Unknown Speaker (00:58:58.400)

He was a good guy.

Unknown Speaker (00:58:59.400)

Sad I had to murder him!

Unknown Speaker (00:59:01.519)

Yeah, so he's got like... they've got a team that's got proficient in knives.

Unknown Speaker (00:59:08.320)

Get the fuck out of here.

Unknown Speaker (00:59:09.800)

You've got like the dirty dozen.

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Fucking asshole.

Unknown Speaker (00:59:12.280)

You've got the guy who's a sharpshooter.

Unknown Speaker (00:59:15.360)

You've got a knife guy, probably an explosions person.

Unknown Speaker (00:59:18.719)

Yeah, there's got to be an explosions expert.

Unknown Speaker (00:59:20.280)

Oh, wait, I've got to correct myself.

Unknown Speaker (00:59:21.980)

Explosions aren't precise enough.

Unknown Speaker (00:59:22.980)

No car bombs.

Unknown Speaker (00:59:23.980)

No, no, there's a grease man, of course, who can get into narrow situations.

Unknown Speaker (00:59:26.639)

Yeah, of course.

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I get it.

Unknown Speaker (00:59:28.639)

And one of the things that I think makes his story seem maybe more believable for Alex

Unknown Speaker (00:59:33.179)

is this next clip talking about the sort of... it's not exciting to kill people.

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That kind of thing is counter to what you would expect somebody telling this story to

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say, and so it lends a little bit more credibility since it's sort of off expectations.

Unknown Speaker (00:59:52.400)

The dull throbbing horror of taking another person's life and of using torture techniques

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to extract information, of course, plays heavily on one's soul and is very difficult to deal

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with.

Unknown Speaker (01:00:05.679)

Yeah, I'm sure it's already been so bad.

Unknown Speaker (01:00:06.679)

You would ask, how did I address it?

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Frequently, these individuals, we would either catch them with child or we would catch them

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surrounded by video or photographic images of this individual abusing children.

Unknown Speaker (01:00:20.280)

Seeing those images, it was not too difficult then to use the methods in which I was trained

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to extract the information.

Unknown Speaker (01:00:28.679)

Yeah, you're literally just sending a demon back to hell.

Unknown Speaker (01:00:31.320)

Yeah, so it's a dull throbbing horror as opposed to an exciting, flashy, tense situation.

Unknown Speaker (01:00:38.960)

No, no.

Unknown Speaker (01:00:40.519)

I mean...

Unknown Speaker (01:00:41.519)

This would be a fucked up interview no matter what, really.

Unknown Speaker (01:00:44.719)

I don't know, like, where are you at in your own brain that you can hear somebody in such

Unknown Speaker (01:00:53.019)

a banal way just be like, I executed hundreds of people and torture with no legal justification

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beyond what it was we saw.

Unknown Speaker (01:01:03.960)

We have an archangel mandate.

Unknown Speaker (01:01:06.280)

Exactly.

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License to kill, baby.

Unknown Speaker (01:01:08.280)

And then I'm listening to this person and I am in Alex's place going, ooh, ah.

Unknown Speaker (01:01:13.280)

Instead of, you're a fucking terrifying psychopath and you need to be stopped at all costs.

Unknown Speaker (01:01:18.920)

I should say that Alex does have some misgivings about this, and like, emotionally he totally

Unknown Speaker (01:01:23.719)

understands and agrees with killing those people.

Unknown Speaker (01:01:25.360)

Oh, sure, you have to murder people, absolutely.

Unknown Speaker (01:01:27.000)

But he does think that this sets kind of a bad precedent.

Unknown Speaker (01:01:29.960)

It can.

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It can.

Unknown Speaker (01:01:31.960)

So I appreciate him at least giving voice to that.

Unknown Speaker (01:01:34.360)

Right.

Unknown Speaker (01:01:35.360)

So Alex has some, just sort of a, you know, like this is tough stuff, but we gotta face

Unknown Speaker (01:01:40.199)

it, it's horrible, it's upsetting, it's depressing, but as Patrick Henry said, if we don't face

Unknown Speaker (01:01:47.360)

the truth, we'll be destroyed.

Unknown Speaker (01:01:49.559)

All right.

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I'm inspired by that.

Unknown Speaker (01:01:51.559)

Wow.

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It's time to face the truth.

Unknown Speaker (01:01:53.559)

And I think you've already figured out some of the truth and that is that David Race Bannon,

Unknown Speaker (01:01:57.360)

everything he said on the show is a complete lie.

Unknown Speaker (01:01:59.300)

That sounds about right.

Unknown Speaker (01:02:00.360)

In 2006, Bannon, whose previous name was David Dilley, but he had actually legally changed

Unknown Speaker (01:02:05.039)

his name to Bannon to sound cooler.

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He was arrested in Colorado.

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Good change.

Unknown Speaker (01:02:09.039)

Good change.

Unknown Speaker (01:02:10.039)

He was arrested in Colorado on a number of charges.

Unknown Speaker (01:02:11.519)

Okay.

Unknown Speaker (01:02:12.519)

He was charged with criminal impersonation, computer crime, and attempted theft.

Unknown Speaker (01:02:17.519)

We'll get into the details on this, but the short version is that he just made up this

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entire story about working for Interpol.

Unknown Speaker (01:02:23.119)

US authorities were essentially fine with letting it go, but it became a huge problem

Unknown Speaker (01:02:27.219)

when they realized he was using these fake credentials to quote, solicit fees in excess

Unknown Speaker (01:02:31.780)

of $3,000 for a two-day training course on human trafficking.

Unknown Speaker (01:02:36.219)

At that point, he was actively profiting off of his criminal impersonation, so they decided

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it was time to step in.

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Bannon would go on to take a plea deal where he admitted to the criminal impersonation,

Unknown Speaker (01:02:46.039)

and the other computer crime and theft charges were dropped.

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He got five years probation and was ordered to undergo mental health and substance abuse

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treatment as well as performing 100 hours of community service, presumably not as a

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secret assassin.

Unknown Speaker (01:02:58.960)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:02:59.960)

There's a chance that he actually could have done prison time for this, but the prosecution

Unknown Speaker (01:03:02.679)

specifically decided not to pursue it, and the fact that he had to undergo mental health

Unknown Speaker (01:03:06.800)

and substance abuse treatment leads me to believe that there was something relevant

Unknown Speaker (01:03:10.719)

to that that made it so, like, we think that he's got a problem.

Unknown Speaker (01:03:14.320)

Well, I mean, it gets back to the point of saying something like this, which is if you

Unknown Speaker (01:03:19.019)

did all of these things and you're saying it, you're absolutely out of your fucking

Unknown Speaker (01:03:23.320)

mind, and if you didn't do all of these things and you're saying it, you're absolutely out

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of your fucking mind.

Unknown Speaker (01:03:30.300)

There's something going wrong.

Unknown Speaker (01:03:31.719)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:03:32.719)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:03:33.719)

So the bottom line here is that this guy is a complete fraud, and the stories he's telling

Unknown Speaker (01:03:35.880)

based on personal experience that he's had are all lies.

Unknown Speaker (01:03:39.599)

All the stuff about how he knew that Interpol was ignoring some reports of powerful people

Unknown Speaker (01:03:43.039)

involved in child trafficking are just something he made up.

Unknown Speaker (01:03:45.920)

The stuff about torturing and killing child pornographers, that was from his imagination.

Unknown Speaker (01:03:50.599)

The stuff about the riot in South Korea where he had to kill a man and thus got recruited

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into Interpol, it's a complete fiction.

Unknown Speaker (01:03:56.440)

The Charlotte Observer has a really good article about this where they rely on statements from

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Interpol itself as well as an interview with Bannon's ex-wife to make pretty clear how

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much of a fraud he is.

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She explains that during the period of time he claims he was out there killing human traffickers,

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he was actually, quote, teaching computer classes at a community college in Raleigh.

Unknown Speaker (01:04:14.400)

Oh.

Unknown Speaker (01:04:15.400)

He was in North Carolina, not North Korea.

Unknown Speaker (01:04:17.519)

Well, that sounds nice.

Unknown Speaker (01:04:18.840)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:04:19.840)

By her assessment, Bannon was a habitual liar and she, quote, doesn't think David is well.

Unknown Speaker (01:04:24.920)

He wanted to be a hero and wanted to be a writer, so he created a heroic backstory in

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a book which kind of solved both problems.

Unknown Speaker (01:04:31.360)

Right.

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And she sums it up, it's actually pretty devastating.

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Quote, he wants to be special, but he doesn't want to put in the work.

Unknown Speaker (01:04:39.679)

Hilariously, one of the...

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Wow.

Unknown Speaker (01:04:42.480)

Yeah.

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Jesus Christ, lady.

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Harsh.

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Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:04:46.480)

I mean, that's, you're right.

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That is devastating.

Unknown Speaker (01:04:48.480)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:04:49.480)

Hilariously, one of the sources that did some of the really good work deconstructing his

Unknown Speaker (01:04:53.480)

fraudulent backstory is a website called Bushido.net, which has a forum that's dedicated to exposing

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people who lie about their martial arts background.

Unknown Speaker (01:05:01.760)

That's great.

Unknown Speaker (01:05:02.760)

Unfortunately, Bannon claimed to be a third-degree black belt in Hapkido, and this got some of

Unknown Speaker (01:05:06.719)

the folks at Bushido poking around.

Unknown Speaker (01:05:08.199)

You done fucked up now.

Unknown Speaker (01:05:10.320)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:05:11.320)

You stepped into the wrong fucking arena, my friend.

Unknown Speaker (01:05:14.880)

Yep.

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So they poked around and figured out that he was pretty much clearly lying about that

Unknown Speaker (01:05:19.920)

belt and that led to pulling some threads.

Unknown Speaker (01:05:22.820)

Their post that originally started on how he was lying about his martial arts skills

Unknown Speaker (01:05:26.179)

ended up expanding into a savage takedown of his book, and if their description of the

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plot is accurate at all, this is one of the most ambitious lies I've seen on this show.

Unknown Speaker (01:05:35.199)

Let's hear it.

Unknown Speaker (01:05:36.199)

There's so much international intrigue and murder.

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Bannon even has to kill a friend and lover named Eunmi when he finds out that she's a

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North Korean spy.

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I knew it!

Unknown Speaker (01:05:45.360)

Yep.

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I knew we were gonna get a spy!

Unknown Speaker (01:05:48.360)

Yeah.

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From there, things just deteriorate into an exercise in fact-checking that's almost breathtaking.

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They show that based on the year he claimed it happened, that South Korean riot he says

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he was in could not have actually even happened at all.

Unknown Speaker (01:06:00.679)

What?

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They had somebody in France go to investigate whether or not a French secret servant member

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that he claimed to be engaged to, but died in the line of duty, was a real person or

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not.

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Spoiler alert, she wasn't.

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It was all made up.

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They even contacted the Korean school he claims to have a PhD from, and they have no records

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of him getting a degree at all.

Unknown Speaker (01:06:21.000)

Great.

Unknown Speaker (01:06:22.000)

It's amazing stuff, and it really helps make sense of why the Charlotte Observer article

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about him is titled, The Man Who Lied About Everything.

Unknown Speaker (01:06:28.719)

Yeah, he pretty much nailed it.

Unknown Speaker (01:06:31.360)

I think that this entire interview with Alex really highlights two problems with his show

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that existed in 2003, and he's done zero work to remedy.

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The first is that he's the most gullible Mark who's ever hosted a show of this size.

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Just about anyone can come in and tell him made up stories about something he wants to

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believe, and Alex will buy it wholesale and pass it on to the audience's truth.

Unknown Speaker (01:06:53.199)

People like this guy or Steve Pachanik say the stuff that Alex wants to hear, and things

Unknown Speaker (01:06:56.659)

that make his narratives easier, but they also create a perception that geopolitically

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significant, presumably heroic people, they think that Alex's show is an important place

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to make an appearance, and that validating of Alex's narcissism is just something he

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can't resist taking part in, regardless of how clear a liar he's having to vouch for

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in order to get his fix.

Unknown Speaker (01:07:17.840)

The second problem is actually a bit more serious, and that's because of how irresponsibly

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Alex handles this stuff, he's actively disrespecting the very issues he's pretending to take seriously.

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Uncritically interviewing this Dr. Race Bannon is an affront to people who take the fight

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against human trafficking seriously.

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Instead of dealing with the issue soberly as it exists in the real world, Alex retreats

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into his own fantasies, and in the process helps this guy promote and profit off of creating

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a fake life story that treats the exploitation of children as an intriguing plot point, essentially

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it's a prop to his story.

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Alex should be really ashamed of his participation in this, but obviously Race Bannon should

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get the lion's share of the flak here.

Unknown Speaker (01:07:57.900)

The notion that he created this entirely fake career in Interpol and was using it to run

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seminars on human trafficking is terrifying.

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It's unknown all the organizations that he sold these seminars to, but when he was arrested,

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it came about in the aftermath of one of his speaking engagements on a college campus in

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Colorado.

Unknown Speaker (01:08:16.039)

After he took that gig, the Colorado police caught wind of him and contacted him to see

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if he would do a training session for the police.

Unknown Speaker (01:08:22.699)

He quoted his price, and that was plenty to fill out the warrant.

Unknown Speaker (01:08:26.479)

The point is, he was willing to lie to students about the reality of this very serious issue

Unknown Speaker (01:08:30.300)

of human trafficking, and he was willing to lie to police in a training setting, and he

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probably had in the past.

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This guy's more than a charlatan, he's a person who made his living disrespecting victims

Unknown Speaker (01:08:40.899)

of human trafficking, and it's just amazing that Alex can't or will not see through this

Unknown Speaker (01:08:45.399)

very clear fantasy story of murders and spy novel tropes just because it works to help

Unknown Speaker (01:08:51.640)

him demonize the people that he wants to demonize.

Unknown Speaker (01:08:54.000)

It's a shortcut.

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He's taking a shortcut because he doesn't want to do the work, and the thing that I

Unknown Speaker (01:08:58.199)

really want to put sharp focus on, as much as obviously this guy is the real problem,

Unknown Speaker (01:09:04.840)

his appearance and the way Alex was engaging with it really does have a connective line

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to the present day.

Unknown Speaker (01:09:12.039)

His show sucked in similar ways back then, and he never learned.

Unknown Speaker (01:09:17.079)

He never fixed these holes in the boat or whatever.

Unknown Speaker (01:09:21.119)

It's just-

Unknown Speaker (01:09:22.119)

No, he learned, but he learned that the holes in the boat are what keeps him floating, oddly

Unknown Speaker (01:09:25.779)

enough.

Unknown Speaker (01:09:26.779)

Yeah, yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:09:27.779)

You know?

Unknown Speaker (01:09:28.779)

Yeah, that may be true.

Unknown Speaker (01:09:29.779)

The paradox may be-

Unknown Speaker (01:09:30.779)

Exactly.

Unknown Speaker (01:09:31.779)

May be accurate.

Unknown Speaker (01:09:32.779)

Or maybe he realizes it's in his best interest to sink the boat, and so the holes are actually

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good.

Unknown Speaker (01:09:38.760)

Ooh, I can breathe underwater?

Unknown Speaker (01:09:39.760)

What the fuck?

Unknown Speaker (01:09:40.760)

Yep.

Unknown Speaker (01:09:41.760)

It's-

Unknown Speaker (01:09:42.760)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:09:43.760)

I mean, if you don't get consequences for your actions beyond being rewarded for them,

Unknown Speaker (01:09:49.199)

then you're not going to change your behaviors.

Unknown Speaker (01:09:54.960)

All too often, this is a little bit Skinnerism with Alex of just direct, if you reward him

Unknown Speaker (01:10:00.920)

for this behavior, he continues to do it.

Unknown Speaker (01:10:04.840)

It's very simple.

Unknown Speaker (01:10:05.840)

He does seem to have no ability to experience negative feedback.

Unknown Speaker (01:10:13.560)

There's no constructive criticism in his world, really, that ever seems to exist, and so there

Unknown Speaker (01:10:19.359)

is no negative feedback.

Unknown Speaker (01:10:20.840)

Yeah, negative feedback is just proof positive that you are on the right track, and so negative

Unknown Speaker (01:10:27.039)

feedback is positive feedback.

Unknown Speaker (01:10:28.039)

Right, because those are globalists trying to fuck with you.

Unknown Speaker (01:10:29.039)

Exactly.

Unknown Speaker (01:10:30.039)

And positive feedback, well, that's just positive feedback, baby.

Unknown Speaker (01:10:32.680)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:10:33.680)

It makes for a devastating loop.

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It's brutal.

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So, there was another thing that they have a conversation about that I think is a little

Unknown Speaker (01:10:41.359)

troubling, and that is that they seem to want to, when I say they, I mean Alex and Ray Spanin,

Unknown Speaker (01:10:48.000)

they both seem to want to invade Thailand.

Unknown Speaker (01:10:50.920)

Wow.

Unknown Speaker (01:10:51.920)

The US should invade Thailand because of human trafficking concerns, which I think is geopolitically

Unknown Speaker (01:10:58.000)

weird.

Unknown Speaker (01:10:59.000)

You talk about Thailand, a military invasion, I'm all for it.

Unknown Speaker (01:11:02.319)

I mean, that's pure evil.

Unknown Speaker (01:11:03.319)

Sure.

Unknown Speaker (01:11:04.319)

And in 10 minutes, Bush should get the evidence of what he needed to go into Thailand, but

Unknown Speaker (01:11:08.000)

they don't even have sanctions on Thailand.

Unknown Speaker (01:11:10.479)

We should have sanctions on them, shouldn't we?

Unknown Speaker (01:11:12.760)

Not even sanctions.

Unknown Speaker (01:11:13.840)

It amazes me that the things that we seem to worry about and obsess over, and yet here

Unknown Speaker (01:11:19.319)

are literally thousands of innocent children, and I've been in Thailand on a number of assignments,

Unknown Speaker (01:11:25.520)

and we saw parents with children as young as two years old walking up to brothels to

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sell them into slavery.

Unknown Speaker (01:11:32.399)

This should not be allowed by any citizen.

Unknown Speaker (01:11:35.319)

Those parents should have their heads blown off, and the child should be given to adoption.

Unknown Speaker (01:11:40.000)

And you see, here I am, hearing that, I want to kill them.

Unknown Speaker (01:11:43.039)

I mean, I understand how you could do this.

Unknown Speaker (01:11:45.000)

I'm not denying that child exploitation and human trafficking does exist at all, but these

Unknown Speaker (01:11:51.739)

dudes are having a fraudulent conversation here surrounding a fake lived experience that

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this guy is describing, that's being used to call for geopolitical things like invading

Unknown Speaker (01:12:06.560)

Thailand, starting a war.

Unknown Speaker (01:12:08.079)

I thought Alex was an anti-intervention guy, really against war.

Unknown Speaker (01:12:11.680)

I mean, I just, I just don't, I mean, wow, just really going out there and saying that

Unknown Speaker (01:12:21.800)

where people can hear it.

Unknown Speaker (01:12:23.159)

Yep, should start a war.

Unknown Speaker (01:12:24.680)

Wild.

Unknown Speaker (01:12:25.680)

So they decide they're going to take some calls.

Unknown Speaker (01:12:27.039)

I mean, just really, some asshole said that there's a lot of human trafficking going on

Unknown Speaker (01:12:31.279)

in Thailand.

Unknown Speaker (01:12:32.279)

So you know what, let's invade.

Unknown Speaker (01:12:34.399)

Or at least sanctions, which I feel like Alex shouldn't be for either based on his politics.

Unknown Speaker (01:12:40.079)

What is happening?

Unknown Speaker (01:12:41.079)

I don't know, but we're going to take some calls.

Unknown Speaker (01:12:44.039)

We cannot ignore it.

Unknown Speaker (01:12:45.319)

Dr. David Race Bannon, PhD is our guest, he was a assassin or cleaner for Interpol, killing

Unknown Speaker (01:12:52.720)

low level individuals.

Unknown Speaker (01:12:53.720)

Say that again and tell me it's true.

Unknown Speaker (01:12:56.760)

And using higher levels for blackmail against government officials.

Unknown Speaker (01:13:00.439)

This is amazing stuff.

Unknown Speaker (01:13:01.439)

He has a lot of courage to go public with this.

Unknown Speaker (01:13:03.479)

We're taking calls.

Unknown Speaker (01:13:04.479)

He's got a lot of courage.

Unknown Speaker (01:13:06.479)

Basically a hero.

Unknown Speaker (01:13:07.479)

Does Interpol kill people?

Unknown Speaker (01:13:08.800)

I feel like they don't.

Unknown Speaker (01:13:10.800)

Interpol doesn't even fucking do much, right?

Unknown Speaker (01:13:12.720)

Am I crazy?

Unknown Speaker (01:13:13.720)

Well, they had a couple albums.

Unknown Speaker (01:13:15.960)

Well, I mean, Turn on the Bright Lights was their best one.

Unknown Speaker (01:13:19.420)

It didn't get better after that.

Unknown Speaker (01:13:20.840)

Let's be, let's be real.

Unknown Speaker (01:13:21.840)

I don't know.

Unknown Speaker (01:13:22.840)

Untitled 2 was pretty good.

Unknown Speaker (01:13:25.279)

Don't know enough Interpol songs or albums to make this joke work.

Unknown Speaker (01:13:28.800)

Shit.

Unknown Speaker (01:13:29.800)

Oh, you went out on a limb.

Unknown Speaker (01:13:31.159)

This is a riff dead end.

Unknown Speaker (01:13:33.960)

Yeah, I don't know, I don't know the extent to which Interpol is going around with assassination

Unknown Speaker (01:13:40.279)

squads, but leaving that aside, it's embarrassing the way that Alex has now accepted this story

Unknown Speaker (01:13:46.439)

and is reporting it as opposed to being like, I'm talking to somebody who claims that he

Unknown Speaker (01:13:51.039)

was.

Unknown Speaker (01:13:52.199)

That would maybe be a responsible way to interview this guy with a little bit of pushback and

Unknown Speaker (01:13:58.079)

like let him air the claims, but make it clear that you, as the person the audience trusts,

Unknown Speaker (01:14:03.840)

have some misgivings about the story.

Unknown Speaker (01:14:06.119)

At least some.

Unknown Speaker (01:14:07.119)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:14:08.119)

Instead, Alex is like, this fucking guy rules.

Unknown Speaker (01:14:09.920)

I can't believe we got this guy.

Unknown Speaker (01:14:11.239)

I can't believe we got this guy.

Unknown Speaker (01:14:12.720)

How is this guy available?

Unknown Speaker (01:14:14.239)

What a hero.

Unknown Speaker (01:14:15.239)

Amazing.

Unknown Speaker (01:14:16.239)

So let's, let's really just fucking get into it.

Unknown Speaker (01:14:19.880)

Every time we look back in history, this is an elite practice, is it not doctor?

Unknown Speaker (01:14:24.199)

It is very much so.

Unknown Speaker (01:14:25.920)

And my PhD is in Asian history from Seoul National University, by the way.

Unknown Speaker (01:14:30.680)

And I assure you that all throughout Asian history, as well as Western history, the elite

Unknown Speaker (01:14:36.399)

have pursued this grotesque and dark fetish.

Unknown Speaker (01:14:40.060)

There you go, ladies and gentlemen.

Unknown Speaker (01:14:42.319)

That's the new world order for you, pure trash, pure evil.

Unknown Speaker (01:14:46.479)

Anything else, Will?

Unknown Speaker (01:14:47.479)

No, that's all.

Unknown Speaker (01:14:48.479)

We're proud of you.

Unknown Speaker (01:14:49.479)

Thank you, Will.

Unknown Speaker (01:14:50.479)

Thank you, sir.

Unknown Speaker (01:14:51.479)

Oh, man.

Unknown Speaker (01:14:52.479)

You know what, listeners?

Unknown Speaker (01:14:53.479)

You kept telling me to have this guy on.

Unknown Speaker (01:14:54.479)

What he's saying is accurate, unfortunately.

Unknown Speaker (01:14:57.720)

And I mean, I just, it's horrible.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:00.479)

Let's, and we have to talk about it.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:03.079)

So that's a grim added detail for me.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:05.319)

Like the fact that the audience had requested Alex interview Ben and means that he had every

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opportunity to do some vetting before having him on or preparing for the interview in any

Unknown Speaker (01:15:14.159)

way.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:15.159)

So he wouldn't just get duped by a con man into making a mockery of child exploitation.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:18.979)

The act of not preparing for this interview, I want to be very clear about this, is a choice.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:23.960)

And I suspect it's one that Alex routinely makes because if he prepared, he wouldn't

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be able to justify interviewing these really ambitious liars who help him create profitable

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narratives and validate his own inflated sense of self.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:36.020)

Real guests wouldn't do that for him.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:37.720)

And if he treated the con man he interviews like they deserve to be treated, they wouldn't

Unknown Speaker (01:15:41.520)

provide him with what he needs.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:43.640)

It's kind of like an unspoken, mutually beneficial arrangement between liars.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:47.560)

We get a plausible deniability, you get a platform to say we're bullshit.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:52.079)

And then maybe you get hired by another cop agency to teach them about fucking human trafficking.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:57.840)

In a way that will be completely useless to them as a training exercise and maybe, let's

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be clear, counterproductive.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:03.520)

It might actually impede their ability to deal with this very, very real and serious

Unknown Speaker (01:16:09.840)

issue.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:10.840)

Yep.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:11.840)

Fuck these people.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:12.840)

Amazing.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:13.840)

So anyway, they talk about his book here, Race Against Evil.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:16.199)

I hate it because his name is Ray Spannen.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:17.960)

Fun.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:18.960)

Dr. Spannen, I didn't bring my book to the studio today with me that I got last week.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:24.239)

Who publishes your book?

Unknown Speaker (01:16:25.840)

New Horizon Press, they're an imprint of Penguin Publishing.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:28.800)

Wow, so a big publisher was it, and folks, we interview a lot of folks who publish books,

Unknown Speaker (01:16:37.399)

but they don't just let you write a book like this without checking it out.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:41.600)

They absolutely do.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:42.600)

And you can write any old book you want.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:46.500)

And reading the book, unfortunately, it looks accurate to me.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:50.399)

I wish it wasn't the case.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:53.640)

I have great news.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:54.840)

It's not.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:55.840)

Yep.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:56.840)

So I am actually not entirely even sure that New Horizon is an imprint of Penguin Books.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:01.359)

Penguin has a list on their website of all their imprints, and New Horizon isn't included,

Unknown Speaker (01:17:05.340)

which wasn't a good sign off the jump.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:07.560)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:08.560)

In 2021, they decided to close up shop, and in a post announcing the end of operations

Unknown Speaker (01:17:13.960)

of New Horizon, they discussed the history of the publishing company, and they don't

Unknown Speaker (01:17:17.539)

mention Penguin at all, which is another bad sign.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:20.560)

I don't believe it actually was part of Penguin.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:22.279)

If you were an imprint of Penguin Publishing, you would have mentioned that you were an

Unknown Speaker (01:17:25.279)

imprint of Penguin Publishing.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:26.520)

Probably.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:27.520)

Or at least, like, thanks to Penguin for being a partner throughout, you know.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:32.159)

I don't believe that, but Alex is using that part of his lie in order to establish that

Unknown Speaker (01:17:37.260)

they would have done fact-checking, so therefore, this guy's stories must be true.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:41.640)

Totally.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:42.640)

Absolutely.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:43.640)

And I think that that's just super duplicitous.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:45.239)

What?

Unknown Speaker (01:17:46.239)

It's like, what?

Unknown Speaker (01:17:47.239)

You think they would just let you make a movie out of a lie?

Unknown Speaker (01:17:50.199)

They wouldn't check up on it?

Unknown Speaker (01:17:51.600)

They wouldn't be like, what is the coup d'etat, and why is this guy there?

Unknown Speaker (01:17:56.539)

They wouldn't do any of that?

Unknown Speaker (01:17:57.539)

It's gotta be true, Dan!

Unknown Speaker (01:17:59.039)

Has to be.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:00.039)

Has to be.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:01.039)

So we get some interesting stories here at this point, because I think maybe this guy

Unknown Speaker (01:18:07.239)

with his abandoned characters is maybe feeling a little bit more like, Alex is saying all

Unknown Speaker (01:18:11.479)

this stuff is true.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:12.479)

Sure.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:13.479)

Let's let it go.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:14.479)

Getting a little high on his own supply.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:15.760)

So in this next clip, we hear about how he actually spent some time in a North Korean

Unknown Speaker (01:18:20.579)

labor camp.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:21.579)

Sure!

Unknown Speaker (01:18:22.579)

Get it!

Unknown Speaker (01:18:23.579)

Just a North Korea idea.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:25.079)

I myself was imprisoned in a slave labor camp in North Korea when I was captured during

Unknown Speaker (01:18:31.439)

an Interpol assignment, and my PhD is in Asian history from Seoul National University, so

Unknown Speaker (01:18:37.039)

I'd like to pretend I know a lot about this country.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:40.079)

I can assure you that North Korea has been working on weapons of mass destruction programs,

Unknown Speaker (01:18:45.640)

biological chemical weapons, for 20 years.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:48.399)

Well, I've got articles eight years old where they were testing nukes.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:52.239)

This whole thing of, they gotta attack them before they get nukes is a joke.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:55.520)

Oh, it is.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:56.520)

It is.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:57.520)

It's a huge joke, and everyone on the inside has known this.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:00.979)

It may be that it's now just more politically convenient to draw up this information.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:04.840)

Thanks, Dr. Bannon, you're telling me, so you got captured in this North Korean camp.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:10.000)

How did you get out?

Unknown Speaker (01:19:11.000)

What was that like?

Unknown Speaker (01:19:12.000)

Because we just read the Wall Street Journal article where when the people starve to death,

Unknown Speaker (01:19:16.119)

they hang out their carcasses and sell the meat.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:18.840)

That is correct, and there are many horrendous torture methods involved.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:24.000)

I was only there for a little under a week until I was traded back to South Korea in

Unknown Speaker (01:19:32.199)

what's known as a spy swap.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:34.100)

That is, there was a known mole in the South Korean secret service.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:38.399)

He was actually a North Korean double agent.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:41.159)

He had been captured and was traded back for me.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:44.319)

Got a spy swap.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:45.319)

Yeah, they also got cash considerations and a spy to be named later.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:49.199)

Right.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:50.199)

Yeah, yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:51.199)

First round spy pick.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:52.199)

Totally, totally.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:53.199)

Unprotected for the next 20, 20, yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:57.319)

Yeah, I think that you can get the sense, too, that one of the ways that this guy really

Unknown Speaker (01:20:02.359)

is able to get people like Alex to go along with this stuff is he's very soft spoken,

Unknown Speaker (01:20:07.600)

he seems nice, and then also he clearly has some just ingrained or innate improv skills.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:16.239)

He's able to say yes to just about everything and then move it over to something else.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:21.520)

Like Alex is talking about them serving dead human meat, and he's like, yes.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:26.600)

And also there's a bunch of torture methods, and then he shifts away from having to talk

Unknown Speaker (01:20:30.640)

about the cannibalism.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:31.640)

Yeah, he doesn't need to talk about that cannibalism, that's not part of his story.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:35.279)

But he validates Alex as part of it and then redirects.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:38.560)

How is it that you know so much, Alex?

Unknown Speaker (01:20:40.439)

And I'll tell you also about what's going on, yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:42.840)

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:43.840)

It's a tactic that I think, I think you see Steve do it a little bit, not as much later

Unknown Speaker (01:20:49.119)

though because Steve was more than willing to be like, no.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:52.159)

Now he directed the show, yeah, yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:54.640)

He turned that into no-but.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:55.640)

Alex, you're wrong.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:56.640)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:57.640)

His improv evolved.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:00.739)

Adele got far away.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:03.140)

So we learn in this next clip about his fiancé that he had.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:08.159)

He had this French Secret Service anti-terrorism lady who was his fiancé.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:15.039)

Transformed into Ascension.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:16.039)

Nope, nope, nope, nope.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:17.039)

Different guy.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:18.039)

Different guy.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:19.039)

Different guy.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:20.039)

Are you sure?

Unknown Speaker (01:21:21.039)

I was involved in a joint operation with Interpol and the Counter-Terrorist French DST Agency

Unknown Speaker (01:21:27.920)

where we approached a cell of North Korean terrorists who were using child pornography

Unknown Speaker (01:21:33.460)

and buying and selling children to fund their activities, including a bombing of the Paris

Unknown Speaker (01:21:38.039)

Embassy.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:41.100)

During that confrontation, my fiancé, Shideh Rimbaud, who was an officer with the DST,

Unknown Speaker (01:21:49.159)

was killed protecting the lives of others by a North Korean terrorist.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:53.380)

And that's what ultimately led to my willingly embracing the role that we played of eliminating

Unknown Speaker (01:21:59.439)

these individuals.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:02.000)

And she died in your arms?

Unknown Speaker (01:22:04.000)

Yes, she did.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:05.000)

She died there on a street.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:06.000)

Get the fuck out!

Unknown Speaker (01:22:07.000)

Come on!

Unknown Speaker (01:22:08.000)

And after she was shot, it was really just a moment, just one or two minutes before she

Unknown Speaker (01:22:11.119)

died.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:12.119)

God damn it!

Unknown Speaker (01:22:13.119)

Come on!

Unknown Speaker (01:22:14.119)

Unba, it's just amazing.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:15.119)

It is.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:16.119)

And this is all on the record, folks.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:17.119)

Just incredible.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:18.119)

Let's talk to Dan in Illinois.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:19.119)

Dan, you're on the air.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:20.119)

Go ahead.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:21.119)

Dan!

Unknown Speaker (01:22:22.119)

I'm on the air.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:23.119)

Oh, Dan.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:24.119)

I have problems with this story, Alex.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:25.119)

I got some huge problems.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:26.119)

Yes.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:27.119)

I got some huge problems.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:28.119)

What are you fucking talking about?

Unknown Speaker (01:22:29.119)

The Interpol and the French anti-terrorism unit were fighting against North Korean terrorists

Unknown Speaker (01:22:35.600)

in France?

Unknown Speaker (01:22:36.600)

Mm-hmm.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:37.600)

And then his fiancé...

Unknown Speaker (01:22:38.600)

Yes!

Unknown Speaker (01:22:39.600)

...got shot...

Unknown Speaker (01:22:40.600)

Died protecting...

Unknown Speaker (01:22:41.600)

...died in his arms.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:42.600)

Oh, my God.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:43.600)

This is a little much.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:45.600)

What are North Korean terrorists...

Unknown Speaker (01:22:47.600)

They're trying to bomb the French Embassy.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:50.600)

I don't even want to talk about it.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:53.079)

Okay.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:54.079)

I don't even need this in my life.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:55.079)

I don't know what's happening.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:00.439)

I think any responsible person having this interview would have to be like, what the

Unknown Speaker (01:23:04.199)

fuck are you talking about?

Unknown Speaker (01:23:05.199)

Get the fuck out of here.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:06.199)

Go away, sir.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:07.199)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:08.199)

That is absolute bullshit.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:09.520)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:10.520)

Come on.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:11.520)

That's a scene from a movie.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:12.520)

Ugh.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:13.520)

So, yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:14.520)

Did you, at the moment of her passing, then lower your head and then dramatically raise

Unknown Speaker (01:23:19.640)

it upward and scream, no, at God himself as the rain poured down upon your face?

Unknown Speaker (01:23:25.800)

Is that what happened, sir?

Unknown Speaker (01:23:26.800)

That was in the next chapter, yes.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:28.079)

Okay, good.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:29.079)

So, yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:30.079)

But I think that the two of them both seem to have an understanding of what's going on

Unknown Speaker (01:23:34.300)

in this interview, and that is we're going to be able to use each other pretty well.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:38.319)

Right, right, right.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:39.319)

And so Alex, much like he did with the interview and the whole conversation about Angela Lipsman

Unknown Speaker (01:23:45.439)

and her whiz-kidness, he wants to use this to attack the CPS, because he hates the Child

Unknown Speaker (01:23:53.199)

Protective Service.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:54.199)

Of course.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:55.199)

Of course.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:56.199)

And so Bannon is a willing participant in that.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:57.199)

Yeah, sure.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:58.199)

Why not?

Unknown Speaker (01:23:59.199)

Also, I would add to this that on the wider scale, dealing with this corruption, that

Unknown Speaker (01:24:09.359)

most people in the government are not involved in this, but that statistically the number

Unknown Speaker (01:24:16.079)

one group, when I read in the newspaper, Dr. Bannon can say if I'm right or wrong, that

Unknown Speaker (01:24:20.079)

it's the child counselor, it's the CPS worker, it's the truancy officer, I know they busted

Unknown Speaker (01:24:27.079)

a lot of them here in Austin.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:29.159)

Don't these predators try to get into positions of power over children or the Boy Scout leader?

Unknown Speaker (01:24:35.720)

I mean, isn't that who you've got to watch?

Unknown Speaker (01:24:38.960)

Very much so.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:39.960)

And well said, Alex.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:41.079)

It fits the profile.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:44.039)

Well said, Alex.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:45.760)

Everyone in Child Protective Services is indeed running a front for human trafficking.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:50.819)

Great work.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:51.819)

And truancy officers?

Unknown Speaker (01:24:52.819)

Truancy officers?

Unknown Speaker (01:24:54.239)

It doesn't get more North Korean terrorists than truancy officers.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:57.760)

Public school teachers probably in the mix, too.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:59.800)

Why not?

Unknown Speaker (01:25:00.800)

Why not?

Unknown Speaker (01:25:01.800)

They're around kids.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:02.800)

So you asked an interesting question at the beginning of this, and that was the idea of

Unknown Speaker (01:25:06.560)

how he's still alive.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:07.560)

Yes, of course.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:08.560)

I told you we would get to that.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:09.560)

Yes.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:10.560)

And here's the explanation there.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:11.560)

Question.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:12.560)

Would he ever produce a list of people in corporations, high government, or high religious areas by

Unknown Speaker (01:25:19.560)

name who are in the United States or globally, you know what I'm saying, like a list of them

Unknown Speaker (01:25:25.399)

that were involved that he was privy to that he couldn't go after?

Unknown Speaker (01:25:30.319)

An excellent question, and one I've been asked repeatedly.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:33.939)

If I may say this, and I'm entirely selfish in this account, but that is part of the large

Unknown Speaker (01:25:42.000)

amount of documentation that I keep secret as an insurance policy for myself and my family.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:47.359)

The only reason is if he was going to release that, he had better release it to 100 sources

Unknown Speaker (01:25:53.359)

before he announced it, because if he was going to release that, they would kill him

Unknown Speaker (01:25:57.960)

in a minute.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:58.960)

Well, I understand that, sir.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:59.960)

And that's what I've said before.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:01.439)

You're only safe by going public, folks, not by hiding and sneaking around.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:05.560)

Right.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:06.560)

So this is how liars like this guy lie.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:08.439)

Like he can't produce a list of names because that's his insurance policy to stay alive,

Unknown Speaker (01:26:13.159)

as opposed to it not existing.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:14.560)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:15.560)

It's using the absence of proof as proof itself, which generally speaking is the mark of someone

Unknown Speaker (01:26:20.539)

you shouldn't take seriously.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:22.039)

However, more interestingly, the way Alex engages here is fascinating.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:26.760)

Bannon is saying that he isn't releasing these names because it's his insurance policy to

Unknown Speaker (01:26:30.319)

stay alive, and Alex is saying he's got to do that, and if he wants to release the info,

Unknown Speaker (01:26:34.439)

he needs to release it all in 100 places in advance.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:37.159)

But then Alex remembers that his normal talking point is not that, and he completely contradicts

Unknown Speaker (01:26:42.600)

himself.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:43.600)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:44.600)

Consistently, it's Alex's position that you're in danger only if you sit on information,

Unknown Speaker (01:26:49.479)

and the only way to actually be safe is to live wide out in the open.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:53.479)

What Alex should be doing if he was serious is he should insist that Bannon release all

Unknown Speaker (01:26:57.560)

the information that he has immediately, because to not do so, according to all the things

Unknown Speaker (01:27:02.119)

Alex usually says, that's a threat to his life to not release all of it.

Unknown Speaker (01:27:06.920)

I suspect Alex doesn't do this because on some level he knows Bannon is making this

Unknown Speaker (01:27:10.220)

up and there is no list, so it's best not to press the issue.

Unknown Speaker (01:27:13.880)

The only way really through this interview is playing along, even if you have to contradict

Unknown Speaker (01:27:18.119)

long held positions that you have.

Unknown Speaker (01:27:19.760)

I mean, I think the simplest thing on this one is to, I mean, let's take it at face value.

Unknown Speaker (01:27:26.000)

Is that true?

Unknown Speaker (01:27:27.000)

Is it true that you are withholding the names of the very traffickers that you theoretically

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are 100% against to protect just you?

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What a hero.

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So you're willing to kill in the triple digits, but if any possible harm comes to you, oh

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my God, yeah, I got to protect these billionaires and millionaires who are financing the ongoing

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human trafficking that's still happening that I'm not doing anything about.

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So what you're saying now is that you're willing to invalidate everything you've ever done,

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meaning that every murder you've committed is 100% worthless and on your black fucking

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soul.

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And then if you, fuck you.

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Your selfish desire for safety comes at the cost of presumably the lives of countless

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children and human trafficked individuals.

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If you guys want to play your masculine, I've killed so many people bullshit, if you want

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to talk about courage, kill zero people and die to get that information out.

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Right.

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Far more heroic.

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Yep.

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So Alex is going to take a few more calls, but he realizes like, ah shit, I was supposed

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to talk about World War III.

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Tell you what, Dr. Bannon, do five more minutes with us on the other side so we can let Larry

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finish up and then go to Pam.

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And that's it for calls because I got to cover World War III stuff, just as serious if that's

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actually possible.

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But it is.

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It is.

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We got to get to World War III stuff.

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So serious.

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World War III has been right on the cusp for a long time.

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And that is right now too, again, in 2022.

Unknown Speaker (01:28:53.760)

Yeah, but we're on World War IV by now.

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Seven.

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So Alex really seems to, before this whole thing ends, he wants to know more about these

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killings.

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Sure, yes, of course.

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Seem to be a point of fascination for Alex.

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Thanks Pam.

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Is that normally how you executed them, was with a knife?

Unknown Speaker (01:29:11.760)

Primarily yes.

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My expertise was with bladed weapons and close quarter combat.

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But you say you generally interrogated them before killing them?

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Yes, often we did.

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Did these scumbags usually fight back or did they just grovel?

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It depended on the individual.

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And I can say that there are many occasions where, thank God I was with the team because

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some of these scumbags were very tough.

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We'd like to think of them all being cowards, but they weren't.

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There were grovelers as well, however.

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My goodness, alrighty.

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My goodness indeed.

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So yeah, this interview comes to a close with a whimper, but this whole thing was outrageous.

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That's so fucked.

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Yeah.

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That's so fucked.

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I was very surprised because, like I said, this stretch in 2003 that I've been listening

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to has been really boring and not worth even discussing, really.

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And then I get sucked in by this story of a genius high schooler and then it turns into

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an episode where he's talking to perhaps one of the most brazen sociopaths that has ever

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appeared on his show.

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Wild.

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I mean, that might be an exaggeration.

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Steve's up there.

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Steve's way up there.

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But the particular lies that this guy is selling are, the nature of them are much sicker than

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a lot of the other people that come into Alex's orbit.

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The personal interaction with these stories, what they're about, it's just gross.

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Yeah.

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I mean, it is that kind of like, I feel like the Batman conundrum for these dum-dums.

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You know, like, you want to, oh, the superhero's the guy who goes out, kill inhuman trafficker,

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boom, boom, boom.

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I've got knives.

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I'm killing people.

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And just like Batman goes and takes care of crime and then you're like, yeah, but you're

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not doing fuck all, but masturbating basically.

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You could be doing shit.

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You could be helping people.

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If Batman spent a fucking dollar on helping human beings instead of building a goddamn

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bat boat, then maybe we'd be in a different situation.

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And this guy's doing the same thing.

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Or dealt with the actual problem instead of the symptoms of the problem.

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And this guy's doing that same thing of like, I'm willing to hold onto these names because

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that's heroic, is me living.

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I'm a vigilante that is taking on the piss-ant lower levels of things while intentionally

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protecting the powerful and wealthy.

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Cool.

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You have just told the most heroic story of yourself.

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In some ways, when looked at in that light, it's almost good that this is fake.

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Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:31:52.239)

No, it's incredibly good that this is fake.

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Otherwise they're talking to somebody who is literally running interference for all

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of the most powerful people in the world so they can continue child exploitation.

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A bit.

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Yeah.

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So we have one last clip here, and it's Alex sort of realizing that he didn't get to most

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of the news.

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Nah.

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Just a bunch of other news here that we didn't get to.

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You've got to visit Infowars.com.

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The troops are going to put on the streets of America unarmed ground vehicles that zap

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you and microwave you or shoot you, and the police, of course, will be getting them too.

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And of course, they'll need to use them on you.

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And it's all part of freedom, ladies and gentlemen.

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Before I end this show, I do want to talk about how a black bear mauled a few people

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the other day.

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So I say ban black bears.

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Got it.

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Yeah.

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They want to ban guns.

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An old man out in California drove over and killed six, eight people.

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They're not sure yet.

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Yesterday, I say ban old folks from driving.

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I don't really mean that, but that's the answer to everything in this world now.

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So I think listening back to these old episodes, I understand how the strategy of never getting

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to the actual stories developed.

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Back then, and in 2003 in particular, around this time, it was super important for Alex

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to get people who were listening to go to his website, because that was where they had

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a better chance of getting integrated into the revenue stream.

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The best way to get people to go to the website was to hype up huge bombshell news that never

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actually gets covered on the show, but is totally proven and documented on the website.

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That's where you got to go to find it.

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In that understanding, you can kind of see how his show might evolve to essentially be

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a promotional tool for the website.

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Where Alex's insinuations about the news stories, it should be really seen as a sales tactic

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to get people to take action to go to the website.

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Go to the website is a call to action.

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Not getting to the news is a call to action, essentially.

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Understood in that light, it's absolutely not in Alex's best interest to discuss the

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stories on air, because if he did so, that would give the audience the impression that

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they've covered the relevant topics, and there's no real need for them to go to the site to

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see that coverage repeated.

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I have a suspicion that this was an intentional strategy that also conveniently made it so

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Alex didn't have to do any work, and that's just continued to the present day.

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That's the training that he gave himself.

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Right, right, right, right.

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Also, as it relates to that last part of the clip where Alex is being all snarky about

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banning bears, bears are banned.

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You can't own a bear.

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That's true.

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That's a bad example.

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He's actually making a solid argument for banning guns accidentally.

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We banned bears because of the danger.

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So let's ban guns because of the danger.

Unknown Speaker (01:34:25.119)

Yeah, that actually is a bad example.

Unknown Speaker (01:34:27.119)

Yeah, that's a one-to-one.

Unknown Speaker (01:34:28.279)

If you want guns to just be allowed to live in the woods...

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Then bears should be allowed to live with you!

Unknown Speaker (01:34:32.880)

Well, no, like, guns, you can have bears, like, they could fish on a stream or whatever.

Unknown Speaker (01:34:38.600)

Yes!

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Oh, everybody can have guns, but they can't interact with human society.

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You can't have them in your home.

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You can have free-range guns.

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Yeah, something like that.

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Yeah.

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And in terms of old people driving, that's also a really bad example, because we require

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licensing to drive.

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Like, if Alex wants to compare the relative dangers of old people driving and guns, that's

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great.

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Let's just then treat them similarly and require licenses and universal background checks for

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gun ownership.

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Yeah.

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His arguments are dumb.

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Yep.

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Even these arguments that he thinks he's making that are, like, slam-dunks are just stupid.

Unknown Speaker (01:35:07.560)

No, most of the time, his best arguments are the ones he makes in a sarcastic-sounding

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voice.

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Because he has to...

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Better against his own.

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Yeah, exactly.

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Yeah.

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He has an actual rebuttal with, like, oh, yeah, sure, let's ban bears, dum-dums.

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Is the actual point he wants to make is that everybody should have unlicensed bears?

Unknown Speaker (01:35:27.960)

I think so.

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Unregulated bears?

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Yeah.

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If Thomas Jefferson had a bear, then everybody should have a bear.

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Mmm.

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Actually, that one does make sense.

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Pretty dumb.

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I'm gonna take it.

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So, yeah, this episode was fun.

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It was fun.

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But also terrifying and creepy and gross.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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Yeah.

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Don't get me wrong, it's fun in the Knowledge Fight contest, which is upsetting and...

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Yeah.

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Terrifying and creepy and gross.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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But I think that there's so much more interesting stuff to dig into here than a lot of the present-day

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stuff.

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So it was really nice to have that little breakie for me.

Unknown Speaker (01:35:59.760)

Yeah, nice to have a little breakie.

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Into the past.

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It's gonna kill us all, that little breakie.

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It will.

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We're all saying it now.

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It's terrible.

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So, yeah, I think Alex needs to shape up.

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His 19 years overdue.

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He's got some time, he can figure it out.

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He's still got some time left.

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Holy shit.

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So we'll be back on Monday, Jordan, with a probably check back in on the present.

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Who knows?

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Who knows?

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But until then, we have a website.

Unknown Speaker (01:36:26.159)

We do.

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It's knowledgefight.com.

Unknown Speaker (01:36:28.159)

Yep.

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We're also on Twitter.

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We are on Twitter.

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It's at knowledge underscore fight and I go to bed Jordan.

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Yep.

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We'll be back.

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But until then, I'm Neo.

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I'm Leo.

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I'm DZX Clark.

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I'm Dr. Marbles.

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And now here comes the sex robot.

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Andy in Kansas.

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You're on the air.

Unknown Speaker (01:36:41.159)

Thanks for holding.

Unknown Speaker (01:36:42.159)

Hello, Alex.

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I'm a first time caller.

Unknown Speaker (01:36:44.159)

I love your work.

Unknown Speaker (01:36:45.159)

Thanks for having me.