Transcript/787: January 23, 2004
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Theme Song (00:00:04.000)
Red Alert. Red alert. Red alert. Red alert. Knowledge five. Damn, Jordan, I'm sweating. Knowledge buddies.com It's time to pray. I have great respect for knowledge, knowledge. I'm sick of them posing as if they're the good guys. Xiang Ji or the bad guy knowledge. Dan and Jordan knowledge fight need money Andy and Sandy are stopping Andy and Pam handy in Kansas. And Kansas, you're on the airplane. Huge fan. I love your word. Knowledge by now knowledge fight.com
Dan (00:00:59.000)
Hey everybody, welcome back to knowledge reading. I'm Jordan. We're a couple dudes like to sit around worship at the altar of saline and talk a little bit about Alex Jones.
James David Manning (00:01:06.000)
Oh, indeed. We ID on Jordan. Jordan. I have a quick question for you sir. What's up? What's your blind spot?
Dan (00:01:12.000)
My blind spot today Jordan is I've been looking for some dumb shows just to watch and you know when I need to relax or something, you know a little bit of entertainment course. You can. There's I mean, I've watched all of survivor. I don't really like the challenge. Yeah. Cooking shows maybe have fallen out of grace for me. Sure. I can only look at food so much. I understand. So I found a show. Okay, but I've been I've been I've taken two
James David Manning (00:01:40.000)
if if this is perfect match. I'm gonna be furious. No. Okay. But some are described that to us. Well, some are described to us and it made me want to throw up. No,
Dan (00:01:47.000)
no, no. I haven't checked in on that show. I actually had forgotten since you until you just brought it back. Right. It is a show called The secrets of Skinwalker Ranch. Okay. Skinwalker Ranch is like this place in like, I think it's Utah. That's it's notorious among the paranormal and UFO communities. There's like UFO is there all the time? Okay, okay,
James David Manning (00:02:07.000)
good. I'm okay. I was worried that Skinwalker was like a normal, like, it's a show about a regular branch. And it just so happened to be named Skinwalker Oh, no. As opposed to being a the Skinwalker you know,
Dan (00:02:20.000)
it's being of like, negative lore. Apparently the Skinwalker Skinwalker. But so there's this ranch. I am amazed. You've never heard of it. Because like, it's basically one of the big things and like, parent, but I guess maybe that's not something used but
James David Manning (00:02:35.000)
yeah, I mean, damn, the the number of things I have never heard of are uncountable, that's
Dan (00:02:40.000)
fair. Um, so I don't believe any of this stuff. Right. But they have such an awesome team of people who are investigating. Okay, so there's a doctor who's there for some reason. He's kind of a zero in case somebody gets hurt. There's like ghosts. There's the lead investigator who's kind of a zero right? And then there's the main character of the show who's like an astrophysicist guy from the like a college in Alabama. Sure, who's coming who's supposed to be the skeptical guy, right? That lasts an episode that he's just making excuses for everything.
James David Manning (00:03:16.000)
Right? So he's not gonna get a job at CERN anytime soon.
Dan (00:03:23.000)
It's very clear how much like the beginning is playing out the idea of like, look, I don't know about any of this stuff. Like I like three or four episodes. And he's like when I first showed up, I was very porous. Yeah, of course. Yeah, that kind of thing. But that's one of the great the star okay. The head of security. His name is Dragon
James David Manning (00:03:44.000)
the head of security at Skinwalker Ranch or the head of security for this team of security at Skywalker dragon dragon he is
Dan (00:03:53.000)
he has so much input on their investigation for reasons unknown.
James David Manning (00:03:59.000)
Okay, all right. I'm gonna say this I'm gonna say this dragon came with Skinwalker Ranch and just emerges from the ground and then returns to the ground
Dan (00:04:11.000)
there's no other explanation you might have come through a portal Yeah, but yeah, there's no other explanation. But yeah, I just I find myself watching it I'm like come on Dragon. And just having that thought is really funny. The premise of the show is that like this like multi millionaire or billionaire guy bought Skinwalker Ranch in order to investigate course. And so these people are always reporting back to this like potty. They're all so desperate for everything to be something that it's it's just hilarious. The episode that I'm on I just started season two. Yeah, the episode that I'm on is entirely about they found a hole and they poured a bunch of water in it and it drained faster than they thought it would right.
James David Manning (00:04:53.000)
I feel like this is not far off from the plot of an Inspector Gadget episode.
Dan (00:04:59.000)
Is it possible This was a vortex we found where all the water is. Yes, Mr. Gadget didn't Yeah, it's, it's it's fun. Yeah. Anyway, I don't know why there's multiple seasons of a question.
James David Manning (00:05:13.000)
Because, I mean, they haven't figured they haven't found it yet. They haven't found anything. Well, yeah, that's why you gotta make another season.
Dan (00:05:18.000)
They think they've found a ton of stuff. Well, of course, but yeah, you gotta think they found a lot of stuff otherwise you might quit very unconvincing. Anyway, what's your bread?
James David Manning (00:05:27.000)
My bright spot? Dan is the new album from Ma three. first album in a long, long time, some
Dan (00:05:35.000)
sort of electronic rock. Yeah, it's stuff right. Speed
James David Manning (00:05:39.000)
moves. Everybody remembers. Midnight city.
Dan (00:05:41.000)
Yeah, I recall that. Yeah, that's come up on a few playlists. Spotify recommended thing, right?
James David Manning (00:05:48.000)
Yeah. And, you know, ma three is always a reliable source for a surprise saxophone, which, as we all know, and love.
Dan (00:05:56.000)
Yeah, you know, that's what you need is best when a saxophone isn't expected. And it
James David Manning (00:05:59.000)
just shows up out of nowhere, and he always does it in the right way. You're like, this is all be boobs. This is all and then bam. Saxophone solo.
Dan (00:06:07.000)
There's a new album, though. Yeah, that's pretty good. All right. I would suggest to check that out. I'm trying to listen to more music in times when I maybe would have listened to podcast. Right, right. We're trying to diversify a little bit because there's so much just talking. And you know, music brings something to your life. Yeah,
James David Manning (00:06:23.000)
no, I, I haven't listened to a lot of podcasts for a while. You know, like I've cut way, way back and I'm listening to music Well,
Dan (00:06:31.000)
probably isn't something else as podcasters should be.
James David Manning (00:06:34.000)
Honestly, I think podcasts are boring. Oh, no.
Dan (00:06:37.000)
Actually, I was listening to some Bosstones because I needed some horns. Yeah. Expected saxophone guy. I was listening to question the answers one of their great albums. Oh, I did a couple of things first. I always have said that I'm a Bosstones guy from way back. Right. And these are the
James David Manning (00:06:56.000)
wiki wiki Bosstones. Anybody? Oh, mighty mighty. Okay. I got it backwards.
Dan (00:07:00.000)
And I was like, yeah, man, I think I think I fell off around Jackknife to a swan that was the last album that I like, really wasn't too sure. And I realized as I was looking over their discography, I'm like, that came out like 20 something years ago. I still think of it in my head is like, yeah, that was later era Bustos. Because that's a long time ago. But I was listening to question the answers. And there's a song on it called jump through the hoops. Sure. And there's this there's, it's just about like how like, yeah, I gotta go through the motions. Sure. Sure. Yeah, holidays suck. We got to do all this stuff. Yeah. So one verses about Dickey Barrett's job. Okay. It's like my job. It's a nine to five nightmare, right? Sure. All right. Yeah. can all relate. Yeah, we've been there. The next lyric is I'm serving whiskey stale wit and beer. And I as a kid, it always like bothered me that like, that doesn't make sense. He's your main time bartender working at like a hotel bar. What do you
James David Manning (00:08:00.000)
this is a wild west. Cowboy shows up at 830 wanting a little shot of whiskey.
Dan (00:08:05.000)
Dicky Barrett, the king of Boston SKA is working a day. This is what Yeah, never made sense to me. And I didn't have context for it. Because I was like, a kid. I didn't have a job but didn't know nine to five. Like, maybe you boop check in and nine, five into words. So whiskey.
James David Manning (00:08:26.000)
I do like the idea, you know, of Chicago specifically, that like, you know, man, I wish every bar was a 4am bar, just those you know, now these 2am bars. That's not fair. But then you go back for two years. And you've got to think there were people being like, I wish every bar was a 24 hour bar again. What the hell is wrong with people that I can't get drunk at 630 in the morning, you know, now I have to stay home.
Dan (00:08:50.000)
Well, Dickie might have worked at airport. That's possible. Yeah. I don't that's not in the song. But anyway. I felt bad because I've I have this conflicted relationship now that Tiki berets and anti Vax? Sure. Oh, my God broke up the band. Of course,
James David Manning (00:09:07.000)
that'll do it. But, but yeah, the infected Bosstones. Now,
Dan (00:09:12.000)
some of those. Some of that stuff holds up though. I believe early stuff is pretty great. I believe you. Anyway, Jordan. Today we have an episode talking about more noise and other disturbances. by the minute. We talk about Scott called the devil and more. All right. Okay. Now, we're gonna be talking about an episode from 2004. Yay. Because I've been the speaking engagement this week. And so preparing for that has been, you know, I've been juggling a little bit of that. And I was listening to some present day style shirts just to slog and not Bosstones that's for sure. No, and so I felt like we should check back in although we're kind of in a no man's land in 2004 because we know how he covered Saddam's capture, right. not well, right, we know that he still kind of thinks that the bath party is being installed back into power. Right? There's a very bizarre kind of who knows what's going on. It's not talking about the primaries, right? 2004 at this point yet, and so I don't really have a goal in mind, but I enjoy listening to it a lot more, right. There's a lot more information and a lot more stuff you can learn from those. And so I was dipping back seeing what I could find. And the Dean screen is on the 19th of January Gotcha. The evening of the 90
James David Manning (00:10:37.000)
Right. That is when he does the Dean screen. Yeah, yeah.
Dan (00:10:41.000)
And so today, we're, this has nothing to do with that. No, no, just for some sort of gauging where we are. We're jumping back in here on January 23 2004. And today's gonna be probably a little bit shorter than normal. But I found something that I thought really sucks. And so good enough for us, man. This sucks. And we'll get down to business on that. But first, Jordan, let's say hello to somebody who wants Oh, that's great idea. So first self elected president of the butler, Pa knowledge fight fan club. Thank you so much. You are now policy wonk.
Alex Jones (00:11:16.000)
I'm a policy wonk.
James David Manning (00:11:17.000)
Thank you very much.
Dan (00:11:19.000)
You're trying to be the new Chico they are. Yeah,
James David Manning (00:11:21.000)
that's happening.
Dan (00:11:22.000)
Yeah. All right. Welcome to Pennsylvania douche I guess. Next Knox revenge. Thank you so much. You are now policy. Well,
Alex Jones (00:11:28.000)
I'm a policy wonk.
James David Manning (00:11:29.000)
Thank you very much. Next,
Dan (00:11:31.000)
I just wanted to hear Dan and Jordan say Susquehanna. I think that's I'm probably mispronouncing that. But anyway, you're now policy walk.
Alex Jones (00:11:38.000)
I'm a policy wonk.
James David Manning (00:11:39.000)
Thank you very much. I believe it's Susquehanna, Susquehanna something like that walk
Dan (00:11:43.000)
up. Next. I'm Father Jones is syrupy, sweet Texas drawl. Thank you so much. You are now suppose you want
Alex Jones (00:11:48.000)
I'm a policy wonk.
James David Manning (00:11:50.000)
Thank you very much.
Dan (00:11:51.000)
And Studio Ghibli piddly presents, my neighbor, pathetic. Thank you so much. You're now ballsy walk.
Alex Jones (00:11:56.000)
I'm a policy wonk.
James David Manning (00:11:57.000)
Thank you very much. Hey,
Dan (00:11:58.000)
we got a technocrat in the mix. Jordan, so thank you so much to Jar Jar. Binks has a Caribbean style hot sauce named after him. And it's delicious. Thank you so much. You are now a technocrat.
Alex Jones (00:12:07.000)
I'm a policy wonk.
James David Manning (00:12:10.000)
The amount of intelligent brilliant someone someone sodomized, sent me a bucket of poop daddy sharp.
Alex Jones (00:12:16.000)
Jar Jar Binks has a Caribbean black action. He's a loser. Little little teeny baby. I don't want to hate black people. I renounce Jesus Christ,
Dan (00:12:27.000)
but they'll be a good hot sauce. Probably a habanero bass. Yeah. You know, Caribbean sauces tend to enjoy a little bit of those fruity or peppers. Yeah,
James David Manning (00:12:34.000)
I mean, I've always had the idea. Obviously, being from Chicago to make Jar Jar links, you know, you make that's it just makes perfect sense. Yeah. And you You jerk them? You know, that way. You've got the Caribbean style shipping it all work. But you
Dan (00:12:50.000)
have to always like if you're serving them, you have to like juggle them and almost drop them on the floor. Yes.
James David Manning (00:12:56.000)
It is also a physical comedy beta.
Dan (00:12:59.000)
Store pratfalls. Yes, absolutely. So Jordan, like I said, there's not a lot going on, we get into like a real deadzone of content check. Alex preoccupies himself quite a bit with building seven stuff, about 911. But it's not stuff that we haven't heard before. And so pretty bland. But he's very, very excited about it. And so that takes up a lot of his time over the course of multiple days. And it took a while to get to anything that I really thought merited our attention. And I'll be honest, at first, I didn't even think this was it. But after looking into it a little bit more, I found that it was quite important.
Alex Jones (00:13:46.000)
Welcome, my friends. It is Friday, the 23rd. day, January 2000. And for I still can't get used to that. Like yesterday, right now. The nine make broadcast lined up for you. We've got Operation Rescue West, coming on in the second hour. It's a First Amendment issue, not just trying to stop the 45 million plus murders. But they have a big truck with a picture of a baby alive baby and then a dead baby on the side. And they've been arrested and are being charged. They're trying to tell people all over the country that they cannot expose what's really happening. But PBS in a show video of all the dead Jews and world war two images of 1000s of naked bodies being bulldozed into pitch and I think that's good. It's good that they show that we should know what evil is all about. We should see the results of of evil. And what happens when you don't stand up to it. But you can show the murders in Africa murders by Saddam I'm in the Middle East, you can show murders by Pol Pot, you can show murders by Hitler. But you better not show the murders in this country. They're taken down websites that show this all over the place.
Dan (00:15:12.000)
I got a couple of points on this one. The first is that I think that if someone was driving around in a van with pictures of victims of the Holocaust on the side of it, that might also not be super appropriate. I don't think that the reality of human atrocities should be watered down or ignored. But there's a place for that kind of thing. And maybe the side of a van, isn't it?
Jordan (00:15:29.000)
I mean, a if your argument is that the van is a good place for it, and the other side of your van has a unicorn on it. I think we're having a bad day.
Dan (00:15:40.000)
Well, yeah. But Alex is also comparing like something that was in a documentary versus something that's on the side of a thing,
James David Manning (00:15:46.000)
I think should be put on the side of a van that isn't a dragon or a unicorn
Dan (00:15:51.000)
or business name. Yeah, something Oh, yeah, that
James David Manning (00:15:54.000)
was also an option. Second,
Dan (00:15:56.000)
there's a difference between all of those things that Alex is listing off versus abortion, all of those other things are murders, whereas an abortion it is not. He's Welcome to his very strongly held belief that it is but that's not going to impact on most of the rest of the country feels. So this story has to do with an anti abortion group called Operation Rescue West who were charged with a misdemeanor for what they call their truth truck. The issue wasn't that they had pictures of dead babies on it. It was that in Bel Air Kansas, there's an ordinance that prohibits cars with portable signs on them, essentially banning moving billboards. The charges were dropped in March, most likely because it wasn't that big of a deal, and the city realized that the group thrived off being persecuted, so maybe wasn't even worth the trouble. Yeah. Operation Rescue West was led by a man named Troy Newman, who's going to be the guest that comes on here later, and a large amount of his specific activism against was against a reproductive care doctor in Kansas named George Taylor. In fact, the misdemeanor charge happened when he was driving his truck near the home of one of Taylor's nurses in a very clear attempt to harass and intimidate her. For years. They went after Tiller to the extent of planning a mock trial accusing him of mass murder. Incidentally, Tiller was murdered himself on made in May 2009. tillers murderer Scott Roeder was a frequent donor to Operation Rescue West and when he was arrested the phone number for Operation Rescue West's senior policy adviser Cheryl Solon, Salander was found in his car. Salinger, when pressed on it had to admit that she had spoken with rotor in the past and had specifically given him information about tillers whereabouts in the past like court appearances on the like, also sell under served two years in jail quote, after pleading guilty to conspiring to bomb an abortion clinic in California in 1988. I looked he's gonna have this guy from Operation Rescue west on the show to complain about this misdemeanor charge that's going to be dropped in a few months. But it's critical to understand that what is happening is that Alex is interviewing someone who is a stochastic terrorist, quite frankly, this is an attempt to play up this false sense of victimhood and aggrievement, which is a large part of the fuel that these groups use to inspire the domestic terrorism against people who support or provide reproductive health access. This is who Alex has always been. When we go back to the past, we see constant appearances by thinly disguised Nazis and white supremacist, we see promotion of groups that inspire domestic terrorism. And you see that in the present day, too. This is who he is. This has never been different. It's just not been as obvious in the past maybe. Well, I mean, or people weren't paying attention.
James David Manning (00:18:30.000)
I be Yeah, it's who was investigating this dude. You know, who was investigating? Who is like, Hey, Alex is having a literal terrorist on his show. Like nobody was paying attention to him. Nobody was paying attention, not just to Alex, but to the guests that he had on Yeah, he's just got another crazy conspiracy theorist on
Dan (00:18:51.000)
I honestly don't even think it's that I think that people will just pick who Yeah, no,
James David Manning (00:18:56.000)
yes. For the people who would have made such a period, though. That's their perception. Because we know that all the way up until, however, practically now still, you know,
Dan (00:19:07.000)
I mean, I think that so much of the criticism of Alex that existed our message boards, you know, even pretty close to up to like our starting of the show. Yeah. had to do with like him being a tool of Israel. Yeah, basically. Yeah. The criticism about him was in itself a conspiracy. Right. And so yeah, there was not a lot of attention being paid to stuff like this, like the cadre of weirdos and dangerous folks that he has on the show. Yeah. So yeah, this dude is going to show up and they're going to kind of have a little bit of an interview and maybe the maybe the only thing that's important on this episode, is this story. That seemed kind of just like a throwaway. Bullshit. They're mad that people have an abortion. Yeah, yeah. But no,
James David Manning (00:19:55.000)
obfuscate what is actually going on by just being like, Oh, look at how it is. sent this van is we should all be aware of what's going on. Well, to be
Dan (00:20:03.000)
fair, I mean, it as fair as you can be, this is a 2004 and Tiller wasn't killed until 2009. It hasn't happened, right, right now granted, their senior policy advisor is in contact with people who may eventually murder and herself, plan to bomb an abortion clinic and went to prison for it. Right. So you have adjacency of like this. I don't know, I haven't looked into enough of the, let's say, anti abortion, pro life groups. But I would assume that there are some who are very disconnected from folks who would bomb an abortion clinic, you would hope. And those would be the folks that I would hope you'd interview the people who are at least more than zero steps removed from someone who planned to forbid abortion, I suppose. But instead, these are the sorts of groups that Alex elevates. He's the sort of people that he gets involved with, and it's not a coincidence. So Alex introduces Troy. And it's weird. He doesn't really know the details of this. This guy's story at all.
Alex Jones (00:21:08.000)
Coin. Newman is the president of Operation rescue.org. And prolife websites have been getting hacked to take it down around the country, folks. They are putting directories into all the big corporations and libraries blocking out patriot, real conservative websites, the neocon websites, you'll never have a problem. We're talking to Troy Newman and World Net Daily Story on infowars.com. From yesterday, he was arrested mostly police out in Bel Air California, and she had picture of the truck there on the website. This is the second time
Dan (00:21:47.000)
Alex is referred to Bel Air is being in California. Yeah, on this episode, because he's the Fresh Prince. Yeah, I understand why that would be where your brain goes. But he has like, here's the here's the thing, like, Troy, and this group is like pretty prominent at the pro life agitation. Right? Let's say. And it's very well known that they're in Kansas, you know, and so that to me, seems strange. One time, it's like, well, it's a slip of the tongue. Obviously, you think of Bel Air from the Fresh Prince. But it I don't know. I mean, it's kind of it's bad sign,
James David Manning (00:22:23.000)
it wouldn't make sense to me because he doesn't actually care about the movement, you know, like, and I understand that he cares about abortion, but he doesn't care about like, oh, well, I need to make contacts in this place, or this place or this place. I need to be aware of who's doing what, everywhere. At this point in time. He's just trying to do a radio show, you know,
Dan (00:22:44.000)
yeah. But if you if you care somewhat about the issue itself. You'd know a little bit about the notable figures, you'd think like you'd think I'm aware of where other people in like disinformation research are sure. At least generally speaking. Right. Right, right. I don't know. It seems. It seems like a bizarre level of not caring.
James David Manning (00:23:08.000)
Well, I mean, but think about it this way. Dan, you are aware of disinformation space, right. I'm also on the show. I'm I'm not aware of too much of the disinformation space because I'm an entertainer, right? If Alex is an entertainer, if you were interviewing somebody,
Jordan (00:23:26.000)
okay, well, that's fair. Who was ever
Dan (00:23:30.000)
ticular I know
Jordan (00:23:31.000)
fine.
Dan (00:23:33.000)
I think you have a responsibility to know a little more good point. So anyway, Troy comes in, and him and Alex do some lying about stats.
Troy Newman (00:23:41.000)
Well, we're pro life organization started to bash about 15 years ago with the sole purpose of ending child killing in America. And we're doing it primarily these days through our efforts. That's fine. By bringing a window into the abortion clinic years ago, we said if wombs had windows, there'd be no abortion. You ever hear that
Alex Jones (00:24:01.000)
one? Yeah. So now they have the whole powered color. moves in my mind here. The tests they do where you can see the baby, right? Yeah, this big 3d sonogram? Yes, a 3d. 4d Yeah, there's motion to it as well. Yeah, 4d and now the majority of men and women, the numbers have never reversed the last 10 years are now against abortion. Young people are against abortion than their parents. 72%
James David Manning (00:24:27.000)
of
Troy Newman (00:24:29.000)
young people nowadays, according to recent Gallup poll are consider themselves to be pro life. Well, we took that slogan a step further. If the wombs had windows, there'd be no abortion. We get a window into the abortion clinic. I'm telling you, it's not a pretty sight. Every abortion kills. And it's a bloody gory mess.
Dan (00:24:46.000)
Bloody, bloody, gory mess. So this discussion of statistics is just not real. Gallup has polled pro life versus pro choice self description at least going back to 1996 and in 2004, approximately 43% of respondents called themselves pro life compared to about 49%. Who were pro choice. The highest they've ever pro polled pro life identification was in 2009 at 51%, which I think, you know, if you consider what was going on around then you could consider it a conservative resurgence that was going on due to the election. Obama Yeah, Tea Party sentiment rising. I think you can understand why there'll be a little bump there. Also, in our present day, pro life sentiment is polling almost as poorly as it ever has about 39% trailed only by like, 9096 when it was around 33. These folks use fraudulent statistics to create the impression that their extreme views and extreme actions are actually mainstream and supported by the vast majority of the population. This is meant to help radicalize the listeners of the show, while simultaneously pacifying them from any fears about whether or not what they're supporting is in fact, extremism. And that's, that's the game. Yeah, I mean, 73%
James David Manning (00:25:59.000)
I, here's, here's a here's a sticking point for me. You know, like, I get the idea that if you have a window into the womb, then you see a I don't know, a larval worm growing, or whatever it is. They call them boo. What I don't understand is if you think that's a baby, how is an ultrasound not complete child pornography as well? That's just insane. We're all stupid.
Dan (00:26:24.000)
Are you just pretend you're working on new five minutes? No,
James David Manning (00:26:27.000)
I'm just I'm just a bothered by this insanity. Just how can you not think clearly, it bums me
Dan (00:26:36.000)
out your rebuttal is not compelling. No, it's
James David Manning (00:26:40.000)
not a rebuttal. I understand. It's, it's all stupid.
Dan (00:26:43.000)
That's true. That's true. That's what I'm saying. They're very passionate about we eat eggs. That's true. Not human eggs. Now we will Oh boy, because that's my next planet class raw
James David Manning (00:26:56.000)
human eggs. So yeah,
Dan (00:26:58.000)
the reality of the situation is that this guy Troy, a large part of what he does is rally against George tiller. Right? And because we're in the present day, we know what ends up happening, right? But because they don't, a lot of the behaviors that Alex and this guy engage in on this show look really bad in hindsight, like this clip.
Alex Jones (00:27:23.000)
And I wouldn't expect I mean, I'd expect this in Bel Air California but not Bel Air Kansas.
Troy Newman (00:27:28.000)
We'll we'll tell you what, it's a little bit bigger. And this is Wichita, Kansas, Wichita, which is just one mile south of Bel Air is the abortion capital of world mount if your listeners know that, that that's where George Tiller resides. And he has the biggest abortion clinic in the world. He claims to have more third trimester abortion experience than anybody in the Western Hemisphere call it what it is. He has the biggest death camp in the US. Exactly. And he's got a huge full size crematorium there the day that the smoke billows out with the smoke of the dead babies in his office manager resides in Bel Air.
Dan (00:28:03.000)
Yeah. So Alex is real actively involved in sort of helping push this person as a target. Yeah, he ends up being oh, by the way, I forgot to mention this Tiller was killed in church. He was a church and something like a man and just assassinated. Yeah, that makes sense.
James David Manning (00:28:19.000)
Because it's because they're pro life.
Dan (00:28:24.000)
It's it's really, it's really difficult to to see this and consider any of these actions, like acceptable running a death camp.
James David Manning (00:28:33.000)
Yeah. Well, I mean, not just that, but like, because of the issue that we're dealing with of abortion. The laws to protect those people have been specifically watered down as much as possible. The laws to protect tiller. Were almost as I mean, at that time. What? He was being harassed for
Dan (00:28:54.000)
years. Yeah, that's true years. And what he was doing was legal. Yeah. It was a form later term abortions, but it was not illegal.
James David Manning (00:29:05.000)
So So what is there to do? Why are we allowing this man to be harassed for eight years? Again, and again and again? Reason litical free speech? Exactly. The reason is, because it's political free speech for this man to harm and attack tiller, and it is against the law for Taylor to fight back.
Dan (00:29:23.000)
True. And that's the truth and like the the extent to which you want to, you know, make arguments against access to abortion, I guess you could make the argument that a lot of that is, you know, very much it should be protected free speech. Absolutely. But some of this other stuff, I don't know how appropriate it is, you know, when you have a powder keg type issue like this, saying that this person is running a death camp, saying that kind of stuff, articulating it as like a murder factory or comparing it to Holocaust 70 is a mass murderer. You're gonna put them on trial. I owe for mass murder. These kinds of things, you, you have to understand that what you're doing is trying to incite violence. You're making
James David Manning (00:30:08.000)
it reasonable to kill him. Yes, that is what you are doing here. There's no other public case. Yeah, there's no other explanation you are telling you are telling people who believe you that this man is a mass murderer. Honestly, if this weren't true, then the man who went to church and killed him is a good guy. Because this man is mass murdering people. I mean, but you know what? It's not it's not even close to true. And you're fucking killing people based on these lies.
Dan (00:30:37.000)
Yeah. And consider like the headspace that you're putting people in. Largely that may be a little bit unwell and healthy mentally, who believe will also believe the things that you do. You're telling them that this person is a mass murderer? Yeah. Death, and it's legal, the mass murder that he's doing. Now, a bunch of people have been trying to change these laws in order to get this person punished by laws. We want to deal with this through the legal system, but it's impossible. There. We've exhausted all of these avenues and got it he just, you know, he's gonna get away with it. How? How difficult is it to imagine that what you're doing is making the argument for someone who is unwell to take things into their own hands. Yeah, absolutely. It's, it's ridiculous. And to see Alex so actively engaged in it, in 2004. is, I mean, it pretty gross.
James David Manning (00:31:33.000)
Honestly, it is, it is framing this situation as a moral responsibility to burn down that clinic to burn down the death camp. Not only is it the right thing to do, it is your moral responsibility to do that, as a human being who does not want to watch people die. You know, I'm not
Dan (00:31:53.000)
sure if it's fully framing that. But it's definitely that is what you could hear. You know, it's a possible reading someone could have.
James David Manning (00:32:02.000)
Well, I mean, I if if we actually knew that across the street, there was a death camp, it would be my moral responsibility to go over there and stop it. If I could. I can't even I can't. You might even if I can't. Yeah, you
Dan (00:32:15.000)
might be right. But what if you want to bring witches into it?
James David Manning (00:32:18.000)
Good question.
Caller 2 (787) (00:32:20.000)
The additional perspective is that abortion is actually a satanic blood sacrifice ritual.
Dan (00:32:26.000)
I should clarify, this is a color that they get right, right.
Caller 2 (787) (00:32:29.000)
And they actually grow their power on it. And that's why they feel that you're threatening their power base, and they're going to the extreme to protect it. Now. They've got it basically on a mass scale. And I would venture to say that your guests would agree on this, but I like his input on it also and magic. I appreciate
Alex Jones (00:32:47.000)
your show. All right. Thank you. Yeah, you go back to Herod, you go back to the Egyptian kings.
Troy Newman (00:32:52.000)
You go back to Hitler's nature. I believe the mass killing was empowering them a comment, sir. Well, it even goes back further than that. The Mole bytes were the first people recording the scripture of sacrificing their own children. All the bale and Ashraf worship were sexual immorality and child killing First Corinthians it says those things that you that the pagans sacrifice, they sacrifice to demons. You're George tillers abortion clinic we regularly regularly see notorious witches going in and out of there particularly it's boring and when that big incinerator lights up.
Dan (00:33:26.000)
Yeah, notorious
James David Manning (00:33:27.000)
witches, Horus witches. Yeah. People who are notable for their witchcraft.
Dan (00:33:33.000)
Yeah, okay. Yeah, they're known on the streets as big time witches got. So yeah, so what we have now is Alex is allowing this guy to put on a presentation that not only is George Taylor a mass murderer, he's complicit with witches are doing a blood sacrifice with these dead babies, or these, these aborted babies in order to gain satanic power of some sort. So now we're adding a spiritual responsibility and dimension to this. And this is so fucked up knowing that like, just a few years after this the guy gets murdered is it's it's insane. I mean,
James David Manning (00:34:13.000)
it it's it. What else do you say? But it's the entire organization's fault. It's all of their faults.
Dan (00:34:19.000)
It means a lot. There's a lot of fault to go around. Yeah, it's true.
James David Manning (00:34:23.000)
It is it is one of those things where again, that is the that is the lack of protection. This man can go murder an abortion doctor. And what people will say is look at this unhinged man. And that's not true. Well, actually, that's a man who's trying to save your life. That is a man who believes that he is saving human lives despite the fact that everyone is against him. In his mind. He is perhaps the most noble creature on this fucking planet. And you're going to tell him he's an unhinged No, this man has been fuck Stover
Alex Jones (00:35:00.000)
Well,
Dan (00:35:01.000)
I think that the the actual murderer? He is, I think he may have been a bit unwell himself for sure. But that's not but what you're saying. Does, you know there is there's something to it, you know, the you think that you are the noble person who's going in to save effort? Absolutely. And you have these people like Alex and like, Troy, on these large platforms, essentially convincing you that you are the good guy, you behave in the way that you do, you know, makes me think of the guy who went with a gun to combat ping pong. You know, like, that person didn't think he was hurting people. He thought he was going to save children. Yep. And I think that that is one of the ways that you can get people to do awful things is by convincing them in some perverse way. They're awful action is actually morally obligatory, or morally commendable. Just
James David Manning (00:35:54.000)
that but after the fact, what are what are these people going to do? They're going to say, that was wrong, he should not have killed him. Now, he may have brought it on himself a little bit with his murdering of babies. But that is not how we behave. anti abortion friends
Dan (00:36:14.000)
are peaceful. That's a large part of what Newman said afterwards. I don't know this guy. This guy. This guy was very wrong. No True Scotsman. Absolutely would never want someone to hurt this guy who's collaborating with notorious witches. Yeah. You fucking talking about? Absolutely. Anyway, one of the things that's really neat about this episode, and it's not actually as neat as I wanted it to be, but Alex does get a few calls from pro choice. People. Okay. Now, they're not the best candidates to be making these. They're listening to Infowars. Yeah, it's a self selected bunch. It is. Yeah. But here is one caller who has a belief that people should be allowed to have access to reproductive health.
Alex Jones (00:37:00.000)
Henry in Oregon, you say you disagree with our guest on some issue? Go ahead.
Caller 1 (787) (00:37:05.000)
And do you do? I just want to know where these people get off? Thinking they can tell an individual free sovereign citizen of the Republic, what they can put in or take out of their individual body.
Alex Jones (00:37:18.000)
Okay, is there something to Henry right now on this? It's a human beings it's separate. They decide to climb in the sack and do what they do and what there is. That is why human life is completely separate from this from this Roe v. Wade, of, oh, this is part of your body. That's a human being you know, this
Caller 1 (787) (00:37:41.000)
part. Opinion. ALIX, that's your opinion based on your Bible, buddy.
Alex Jones (00:37:46.000)
I'm not buying your moral relativism. I'm
Caller 1 (787) (00:37:48.000)
telling you that I'm tired of you people trying to stick your Bible in my face, man. I'm telling you that you know, you stick to your own beliefs and leave the other individual sovereigns in this country alone because you're making more enemies than you are friends anymore, buddy. Oh, you're getting really mad deep down. Past Matt. And I'm telling you to tell your buddy to bring his truck to Tilak when Oregon
Alex Jones (00:38:09.000)
put them on hold. I can tell he's about to start getting hateful and spewing things we can't have on the radio. I don't even man I tell you. You make me sick. I can just hear the hate in your voice.
Dan (00:38:22.000)
Yep, so that's me that's about as good as you're gonna get. And that's the kind of response that Alex will have which is put the put the person on hold. He does go back to him but he doesn't really allow him to make any points. So yeah, so I guess Alex's best rebuttal is that it's a person and then the guy his responses. That's your opinion. Yeah, there's nowhere to go from there.
James David Manning (00:38:46.000)
We are at an impasse Yeah, there is no further argument to be had it is a conflict now
Dan (00:38:52.000)
Now unfortunately, you know based on the repeated word use I think this guy might be a sovereign citizen I'm not sure I
James David Manning (00:38:59.000)
may have heard a little sovereign citizen in there I'm
Dan (00:39:02.000)
not sure I want to necessarily side with him and he was getting a little bit distracted in the bring your truck around my area I'll show you what's what
James David Manning (00:39:10.000)
you know once you're at an impasse What else is there to do?
Dan (00:39:13.000)
I guess so. It makes me less willing to be like tip of the hat to you sir. Yeah, that's not maybe the best way of going about it. But you can kind of see how Alex doesn't really want to engage doesn't really respond Yeah. Put him on hold
James David Manning (00:39:28.000)
false moral high ground can go fuck off. I am not doing any of that shit go fuck yourself. Yeah just claimed that their demons and witches and now you don't want hateful content on your show? Go fuck yourself.
Dan (00:39:40.000)
I mean, this is back when Alex would like tell people not to say piss or Yeah, and now he's just like all they want to piss on our face. I'm just saying
James David Manning (00:39:48.000)
abortion doctors are demons who are in league with Satan and they are killing your babies. And now sir, sir. I don't want any hateful content on my show. Okay,
Dan (00:39:58.000)
so Alex has some thoughts about this call. Well, he has them on hold that I think are a little ironic.
Troy Newman (00:40:04.000)
So we've got to look at this from a medical aspect we can look at from a philosophical
Alex Jones (00:40:09.000)
what's wrong with this guy, we got to protect the little innocence, he doesn't get any more weak and defenseless. These are babies body. And you know, this is sick. And what happens is people are involved in abortions, and they're not man enough to, to, you know, to get their minds out from around this. And so, and look, I didn't start by attacking this guy. I mean, I might have gotten mad at him, but I heard a lot of hatred in his voice.
Dan (00:40:34.000)
We know from listening to Alex for years that he has an intense burning guilt over how he's paid for at least 10 abortions. He's never really processed any of his feelings about that, and it manifests pretty regularly and outburst surrounding reproductive rights. At this point, it's not clear if Alex is being honest with the audience about his past abortions. But what we can tell from this clip is that he's very committed to projecting his own guilt onto everyone else. In his own mind, he sees supporting access to abortion as being a way that he could alleviate his own guilt. If it's not wrong to have an abortion, then he doesn't need to feel bad about his past in that area. But Alex is also a religious zealot, and he cannot be pro choice and continued to be at all appealing to the audience that he's fostered. Alex personally is trapped, but he recognizes that being pro choice would be the shortest and easiest path for him to unburden himself from that weight that he needlessly carries around, right. And thus, he assumes that's the case for everyone who supports access to abortion. They don't actually believe in the right to bodily autonomy, they don't have any principled reason for their position, they must just be looking for an easy way to alleviate their own guilt. Alex is mad because he's talking about himself. He can't deal with this color as an individual because the conversation is barely even about abortion. The caller and probably Troy think that it's about abortion, but they don't realize that the host of the show is kind of playing out a psychodrama and using them as props. Yeah, it's fucked up.
James David Manning (00:42:01.000)
Yeah. Well, I mean, that is that is one of the problems with being a guest on the show of a malignant narcissist is a certain point, you got to realize that you're not real to him. Yeah. You know, like, you're when you go away, he's like, man, that character in my favorite show was gone. And now I don't know where he you know, that's it. Yeah. It's,
Dan (00:42:21.000)
it's, it's, it makes it difficult to really find any truth or common ground or anything. So I like to get to another caller that disagrees with his position. And here's how that goes.
Alex Jones (00:42:34.000)
Charles in Rhode Island, disagrees. Go ahead, Charles.
Caller 1 (787) (00:42:38.000)
Alex, I want to, first of all tell you that I'm very conservative. I was a congressional candidate here in the state of Rhode Island. But basically this abortion issue, I've looked at it right down the line. And unfortunately, there's a worse crime than abortion and that's being born and being unloved. I grew up with all those kids over here in the Rhode Island area that were had no reason. You know, their parents didn't care about them or anything and
Alex Jones (00:43:01.000)
that societal breakdown, you don't go further down the pit because, quote, quote, know that when we think you might be on love, you got a poor family. So now we're gonna abort your baby. That's what China does.
Dan (00:43:12.000)
So this caller is articulating his argument for abortion access poorly, but you can see how Alex has taken his point and completely distorted in order to create a straw man that it's easier for him to fight with the idea of having access to abortion for people who end up in situations where they have an unwanted pregnancy. It's not like China's one child policy. It's not forced abortions. This is a ridiculous leap that Alex is making, because he never actually wants to argue real points. He wants to score optical points about like, Oh, you're disgusting. You think that people should just be why do we find people who aren't loved and kill them? Yeah, that's what we should be doing. It's so dumb.
James David Manning (00:43:48.000)
Yeah. And I mean, especially just because it's so performative. Yeah, you know, there's no conversation. There's nothing that can be said or will be said that will have any effect on this. Yeah, this is all for show.
Dan (00:44:01.000)
And it's unfortunate too, because even people that you would sort of the, on the surface agree with or broadly agree with, as much as like, people should have access to reproductive health care chair. They're still ALEKS listeners. And they're not going to be able to make these arguments in any way. That's like, you know, they're going to fall into rhetorical traps, right? Well, I mean, here's the broader be idiots themselves, right?
James David Manning (00:44:25.000)
The problem is to be pro choice is a very straight line, right? But to be pro choice, and also a conservative or also somebody who's listening to Alex Jones, all that stuff, you are going to inevitably have to take a twisty path around all of those giant obstacles to going straight to abortion. So that means that when you're having a conversation with somebody else who's a conservative they go, Well, why didn't Why did you go around this obstacle? That is there for a reason. You are supposed to stop at that obstacle? Yeah, yeah. Listen to the roadblocks. Exactly, yeah. So there's there's no way to have that conversation. Intra intra party,
Dan (00:45:05.000)
I suppose. Yeah. So we get another caller who is sort of pro reproductive. Okay. But there's I'm just gonna play a tiny bit. We're not gonna listen to this call because it's a real bummer. Okay.
Alex Jones (00:45:18.000)
Okay, we got a bunch of callers that agree with you. But we got one more that disagrees. Mary in Maryland, you're on the air with our guests. Go ahead. Yes, thank
Caller 3 (787) (00:45:27.000)
you. I like your show except for this issue. I wish I had been aborted myself, I have done a lot of research. And I would like to make a few points.
Dan (00:45:38.000)
So it's pretty easy to see how Alex go to imagine that the opposition to his position is not very well considered given the callers that disagree. But he doesn't take into account that he's self selected zone opposition. People have strong well reasoned pro reproductive health arguments aren't going to be listening to Alex's show and they aren't going to call in the opposition, he has to worry about contending with our people who listen to his show that disagree with a central pillar of his worldview, which are going to be generally confused folks who are easy to dismiss, on the off chance that he gets them on with a good point calling him it's the easiest thing to just restate their argument in a dishonest way to create a straw man to attack or put them on hold and the job is done. My point is that if Alex had to argue with people who weren't Infowars listeners, he'd be fucked. Also, this lady's call is a real severe bummer. And I feel for her. She says that, and if she goes on to talk about, like abuse that she had as a child, and like her mother having, like complications from her birth, you know, it's a real heavy thing. And Alex is just as a real shithead to her. Like he's real. He's a real dick. Yeah. And I don't think it brings much to our show to to dwell on that.
James David Manning (00:46:48.000)
Yeah, I mean, here's the thing, what I would expect if we were going to have a conversation about this particular topic, at the very least, what should be represented? Are the parties directly involved with it?
Dan (00:47:01.000)
Yeah, those are the people who have any kind of skin in the game. It's
James David Manning (00:47:06.000)
not some random guy who drives around in a van. And not even people who just call in, that's not a, that is not a way to have this conversation in a way that should be had publicly, if they want to argue about this nonsense, that they're never going to convince each other of no off air, then that's fine. You're having fun. If you're doing it on air, you're just messing with everybody's lives. You're wasting everybody's times and you're confusing them.
Dan (00:47:36.000)
Well, I think there can be sort of points that are illuminated by talking to people who are maybe unrelated to the doctor patient dynamic of an abortion that like, I think, I think some people can have worthwhile things to add to the conversation. But generally, it's not going to be a guy who's shithead radio host guy whose career is harassing an abortion doctor, right? Those aren't the sort of people it is just going to be like, at worst and at best, some sort of, like a explosion of, quote unquote entertainment. Sure, sure. Sports type shit with a collar. Yeah,
James David Manning (00:48:19.000)
this is not sports, talk radio. We are not arguing about whether or not the fucking giants should have drafted Odell Beckham Jr. This is real shit, man. It's true. No,
Dan (00:48:31.000)
it's true. But I think they think that they're dealing with it appropriately. Yeah. But they're not evidenced by this next clip. Oh, boy.
Alex Jones (00:48:39.000)
Earlier caller was asking you I believe Allison in California about this particular abortionist there in Kansas, who quote was doing some some rituals. Is that accurate?
Troy Newman (00:48:49.000)
Yes. And I'll get to that in just a second. I just wanted to just ask a quick question. answered to yourself. Listen to the callers as they come through and the mental gymnastics that they've gone through in order to justify child killing and it's what George Tiller does here in Wichita, Kansas. He's a member in good standing of his reformation Lutheran Church. He brings in an apostate pastor to baptize these babies. He'll sell you a keepsake urn after he incinerates the bodies of these babies after he baptized and he'll, they'll sell you the urn, put the ashes in there and send you home with them. There's some bizarre rituals that he does. He'll take pictures of the babies if you want to have some post natal pictures of your unborn baby with a crushed skull. He'll provide you those pictures. There's a little room that he's got set aside and his abortion millwork sounds like a snuff film production
Alex Jones (00:49:40.000)
company.
Troy Newman (00:49:41.000)
You know, that's exactly what I said. And I think he's got a very strange, bizarre mental condition because it's a bizarre fascination. Well,
Alex Jones (00:49:50.000)
let me just say this earlier, we were pretty nice to one of those callers.
Dan (00:49:53.000)
I would disagree pretty nice. So a lot of that stuff that you is describing as snuff film production or like weird, bizarre rituals? Sure. I think it's an underappreciated aspect, certainly among people like Alex and these these folks that it's not always very easy choice that people make to terminate a pregnancy. And sometimes things like, you know, having some kind of booth, you know, cremation or something. Yeah. Now, it can help help closure have closure for the parents, right. And I think that there's something, they're attacking this as something evil, but it's actually one of the most probably carrying services that a person in tillers position could offer. Sure, these are things that allow you know, someone who had to choose something that is very painful allows them to have a closure about it allows them to honor this, this the fetus, yeah, you know, there's, there's something that can be very helpful and meaningful to that. And it's pretty shitty for Alex and him to be going on like this.
James David Manning (00:51:06.000)
I mean, honestly, regardless of whether or not you're pro or anti abortion, that's not we're past that now in the in the timeline of events, okay. This is not something that Tiller is forcing on people. This is something that they are asking for. They do not have to have this. Yeah, they do not have to get any of this. Yeah, they don't even they could walk in and walk out without saying goodbye.
Dan (00:51:29.000)
Because for some people, it's probably not something they would gravitate towards, or even need, you know, that's not that's not everybody doesn't have the same needs and requirements in that situation.
James David Manning (00:51:41.000)
And so now we're talking about this person, this asshole being like, No, you can't even have any say in what happens afterwards.
Dan (00:51:49.000)
Right? And pretending that these things that are offered as a means of helping the parents process, grieve, grieve. It's some sort of a perverse thing that Tiller is doing for himself. Right? And that's just I mean, it's disgusting. But these are the ways you would characterize someone if you wanted them to be hurt. Yeah, honestly. Yes. Just just ship. That's just horrific. Yep. So earlier, Troy lied about some statistics. And now Alex gets in the game.
Caller 1 (787) (00:52:17.000)
How many abortions are done in America every year?
Alex Jones (00:52:22.000)
Four and a half million.
Dan (00:52:24.000)
Yikes. That's absolutely false. Yeah, CDC numbers with this timeframe around 2003 2000, forward about 850,000. And the trend has consistently been heading downward ever since. And even at that point, it was headed downward. Alex is exaggerating the number of abortions done each year by about five times are not recognizing that number of procedures is decreasing as education improves, and there's greater access to birth control and emergency contraception. Alex is a liar painting a fraudulent picture for the audience to help justify his extremist views and make them more likely to support a group like Operation Rescue West whose senior policy adviser went to jail for planning to bomb a clinic and who very clearly inspired the murder of George tiller, right? There's not even a reason to lie here. His audience doesn't understand numbers or scale. So if he said 850,000 abortions are done each year, they'd be just as scandalized by it, this guy would still say Yikes. But on some level, Alex cannot resist the impulse to exaggerate and sensationalized everything he touches. Regardless of how, I don't know if spurious an issue it is. Yeah,
James David Manning (00:53:29.000)
yep. Just, and just the willingness to toss out a number in an instant without thinking about it. Not even like that's, that's me pulling something for a bit, just Just out of nowhere. It's just like, yeah, 5 million, whatever. You should have to have something like, If you don't know, say, Hold on, let me check. Maybe I have a staff of people who could give me the exact number right now that maybe
Dan (00:53:54.000)
that number does come from some, like, evil, anti
James David Manning (00:53:58.000)
abortion blog kind of thing. Where possible, they're under counting the official statistics, we went to this abortion place and everything like that. Yeah, that's possible.
Dan (00:54:07.000)
I wouldn't, I wouldn't be too surprised if that number does come from somewhere not out of thin air, but whatever it is, it is not accurate. The that's fair. So we have one last clip here. Like I said, it's a shorter episode we're going to be doing but in this clip, Alex points the finger at everybody by describing them as himself.
Alex Jones (00:54:25.000)
Oh, man. Whoa. How people can't see what's right right in front of their faces. But the society says it's okay. But somebody's arguments and you're young, you know, oh, I can't do that. I'm having too much fun Horan at the bars. I'm having too much fun picking up all these women. Yeah, I'll just I'll just give 300 bucks to her and then I won't have to worry about it. And then you just blasted something beautiful and wonderful. That was going to take care of you when you were old. Now you're going to be alone on thanks. Giving now you're gonna be alone at Christmas. Now you're going to die alone old in your apartment with no children around you with no nothing. You just took the greatest birthright the most amazing thing we've got any flushed it down the toilet, you put it in an incinerator.
Dan (00:55:17.000)
We know from so many things that he says later that that's what he did. He's talking about himself. Yeah.
James David Manning (00:55:24.000)
No, it reminds me of every like youth group situation where they brought in the evangelical testimonial, the guy who comes in and he's like, listen, for 20 years, I lived like this, and he's got tattoos and all that stuff. And then he goes, but that's not good for you. And he continues on to explain that everyone who drinks lives like he did. Everyone who goes to bars acts like he did. Everybody who's around other people is trying to fuck all the time, at no point in time is the like, well, you know, I could have also gone to therapy or something.
Dan (00:56:00.000)
But here, here's the difference between Alex and that guy, at least that guy is saying I did all these things. That's true. That's a good point. There is no recognition in this episode, or anything of Alex talking about himself and his own experience. He's talking about his own experience, but projecting it onto everybody else. Yeah, that to me is even more cowardly, right in what you're describing and youth pastor because at least that youth pastor would be, you'd be able to be like, dismiss what you say a little bit more. Because it's like, oh, you're dealing with something.
James David Manning (00:56:28.000)
And he's projecting on everybody else, too. But he's telling you, I'm telling you why I'm projected. He's giving you the reason. Yeah.
Dan (00:56:34.000)
projecting on everybody. Yeah, yeah. Whereas this is just like subterfuge almost. Yeah, it sucks. So you have that dynamic. And then the dynamic of trying to launder and promote this group that is up to absolutely no good.
James David Manning (00:56:50.000)
They have started making trouble in the neighborhood. Yeah,
Dan (00:56:53.000)
Bel Air. Yeah. I think it should be it should be recognized to that, like George Taylor was a large name in the reproductive health scene, let's say he was somebody who was the a lot of people around the country even pointed the finger at him. Yeah. And they were like, This guy sucks. You know, he's the worst. Yeah, that is true. But the this guy, Troy Newman and his group, were there. Yeah, they were agitating there. Absolutely. That is a little bit more relevant. Or I think it's more impactful user involvement was like on the ground there inciting harassing them, as opposed to, like, let's say, an anti abortion group on the West Coast, who was still mad at tiller. Right, say, but maybe wrote a letter or something. I
James David Manning (00:57:53.000)
was, like thinking about this time period. What that was, was a terrorist group, assassinating a political enemy. That is what you have to kind of view it as, at least I at least, that seems to me to make the most sense. The
Dan (00:58:08.000)
only only reason I push back on that is that there isn't any real evidence that the guy who killed them was like actually involved with their group. So you could say that it's kind of a like, you know, that idea of the sto tech after caustic terror, blah, blah, blah, right? The inciting someone to do the thing that they obviously want done. Right. But don't say that that's what they want done. You could you could make that argument but and the reason them as a whole terrorist groups,
James David Manning (00:58:39.000)
and I'm doing that is not because I genuinely believe that they are an entire terrorist group, right? I am saying simultaneous to this time period, it the FBI is finding any Muslim person they can to tie together with a group. I mean, so what I'm what I'm seeing is obvious shit of we're making terrorists and we're ignoring the ones that we like, and that's just the case. No, so I while I recognize that, you know, like, I'm not putting them on the terror watch list.
Dan (00:59:11.000)
I get what you're saying. Yeah. Yeah, it sucks. It sucks. Keep coming back to this, but there's a reason. Yes, it sucks. It sucks. Alex's behavior is shit. But it's it. I think you can fall into a little bit of a hole of thinking like, you know, at some point he changed, you know, there was something you know, he Yeah. And like, oh, the Trump years really brought out the worst in him. Yeah. And I mean, from a performance aspect. Yes, that's definitely true. He's become far worse a broadcaster. He's sloppy and unhinged in ways that are meant to farm attention. Yeah. Because that's more of the economy at that point. But, you know, it's important to recognize and understand that you go back as far back in his career as you can. And do you see behavior that is just as detestable and just as dangerous as stuff that he does regularly? Presently? Yeah, I
James David Manning (01:00:11.000)
think what happens is if you only pop in and out, you know, over your life, you know, I only see these clips every maybe I only saw a video last year. And then once again, you can mistake decaying for change. You know what I'm saying? Like, I don't think Alex changed, he just decayed. It just got worse and worse and worse, but not different.
Dan (01:00:33.000)
Yeah, just worse, I think also pivot a little bit. I mean, as much as like, I think a lot of people changed strategies, when social media became more relevant, you know, the ways that you can hack people's attention. You know, I think that that could attribute a lot to that what you're describing as decay. Yeah. You know, a lot of the like, more frequent bombast. Yeah. Shit. Yeah. You know, it's one of the things in trying to prepare for this episode. I was also trying to look at other people we could talk about, you know, like, I texted you about, like, Matt Walsh. Michael Knowles are two dudes who are like, you know, they're both daily wire guys are like, very on the vanguard of pretty dangerous transphobic. Rant ideology, rhetoric. And so I thought like them, maybe it'd be a good I see clips of them flying around all the time on Twitter. And I thought, like, let's sit down and check out an episode of their show. And it became an intensely clear to me that there is a bit that's for attention and then an unwatchable show, right, like the rest of it. Right. And I think that there's a strategy in that. And I think it's because of the way attention economy works. Totally, I think that Alex is fairly similar. No, that's just he's not allowed on social media. We've
James David Manning (01:02:00.000)
received emails from like companies who do exactly that for you, right? Where they say you Well, what they do is they say, we're going to help you make tic tock clips out of your large content to grow your audience. So then all of a sudden, you are not concerned with the large content, you are concerned with making the TIC tock clips go around. And yeah, we haven't. We haven't responded. Yeah.
Dan (01:02:27.000)
You don't have to you don't have to worry so much about the coherence and the quality of your larger product. Do you have to have like, well, it's good enough what I'm doing, but there has to be something that is at least clippable enough that people will get angry, right? Or people will keep reposting this, and I think that those strategies are absent in Alex in the past. Yeah. And that's maybe a large part of why I think that it's more interesting as a product. Yeah, that's fair. Because I find that to be a really dumb boring. I think it's I think that like, I don't know operating have
James David Manning (01:03:02.000)
a vested interest in not doing that, though, since our shows are three and a half hours long sometimes
Dan (01:03:06.000)
operating that way. I just find to be like, the opposite of what someone who wanted to create content would do. And I think it sucks. Anyway. I I don't know. I'm not against doing an episode about like someone like Matt Walsh or whatever. But his episodes are boring as hell. Yeah.
James David Manning (01:03:23.000)
Well, you know, to me, it is, you know, I was always I was always working on putting together an hour, you know, yeah, I wanted a headline. So I wanted to get an hour. And it took a long time to realize that a lot of people wanted to get five minutes. So they could put the clip out and then get out is booked for an hour get booked for stuff and then they'll figure out how to how to write jokes. It never occurred to me to go that way. Because that's a shortcut. Yeah.
Dan (01:03:49.000)
Get a good tape. It's cheating. Get a good little snippet of your opener.
James David Manning (01:03:56.000)
Yeah, I mean, it's like I would never in a million years try and get a headline gig until I was confident in 45 minutes of an hour.
Dan (01:04:06.000)
works. So anyway, now we come to the end of this and fuck Alex in the past. You bet sucks. Bad dude. We'll be back Jordan, but until then we have website
James David Manning (01:04:15.000)
didn t we do? It's now try.com. Yes, we're also on Twitter. Indeed. We are at that knowledge. I'm just gonna fight.
Dan (01:04:21.000)
Yep, we'll be back. But until then, I'm Neo. I'm Leo amnesiacs. Clark. I'm the juiciest ice cube.
Unknown Speaker (01:04:26.000)
And now here comes the sex robots.
Andy In Kansas (01:04:28.000)
Andy in Kansas, you're on the air. Thanks for holding. Well, Alex, I'm a first time caller. I'm a huge fan. I love your work.
