Transcript/93: 2015 Investigation Last Looks

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Andy in Kansas, you're on the air, thanks for holding.

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Hello Alex, I'm a first name caller, I'm a huge fan, I love your work.

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I love you.

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Hey everybody, welcome back to Knowledge Fight, I'm Dan.

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I'm Jordan.

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We're a couple dudes, I like to sit around, drink novelty beverages, and talk a little bit about Alex Jones.

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But today we have returned to our roots, my friend, and we are drinking the reddest of red blends.

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Sure, 14 Hands.

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14 Hands, because it's all 14 Hands on deck.

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Oh, you know what, you're not wrong.

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Yeah.

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You might have just bought that randomly, but today-

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I did not.

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Today it is all Hands on deck, we got some serious business to go through.

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Let's do it.

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As I described to you a little bit before the show, oh, this is also a podcast where I know a lot about Alex Jones.

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How much do I know about him?

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Almost nothing.

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Good call.

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But, I did get a tweet from a listener, whose name escapes me at this point and I apologize.

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But they made a good point that at this point, we're almost a year into this, you don't know almost nothing about Alex Jones.

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And that's an unfair way for us to open the show, it's kind of bullshit.

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I think they're highly overestimating my ability to remember anything that you tell me.

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Okay, maybe I know a lot about Alex Jones, and you have forgotten a lot about Alex Jones.

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Yeah, that's probably true.

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Maybe that's a more accurate way for us to start the show.

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But be that as it may-

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Yeah, that suggests that I have ever listened to you. I think I really just talk.

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Unfair.

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Yeah.

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Rude, I don't appreciate it.

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I'm sorry.

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So, last week, on Monday, we put out an episode where-

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Because I think the thing you hate about me is that I interrupt you, Alex.

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Not that I hate it, it's frustrating. It's conversationally difficult.

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I know, I had to do it there.

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So, last week, we put out an episode where we essentially ended the 2015 investigation into why Alex Jones joined up with Team Trump.

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Indeed.

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I declared it dead, we know pretty much for a fact that he joined up because Roger Stone is lying to him on a massive scale.

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And on top of that, Russia.

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Right.

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And that was where we left off.

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And he got a gold star from Trump and went home to his mother.

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He did. He got a gold star from our friend Steve Pachanik, who's going to factor heavily into this episode, actually.

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Okay, alright.

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But I realized, I sat down and I did some thinking. I thought about it a bit.

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And I realized that we might have been a little bit capricious in ending the investigation or in declaring case closed.

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Right, absolutely.

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And one thing triggered that in my mind. There was something that happened the other day on Alex's show that I covered on an episode while we were alone.

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I was alone. You weren't on the show for that.

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There was an instance, there was something, I'm sorry, I had to go grab the clip because I forgot to load it up.

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Take your time.

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But here it is. This triggered something in my brain and made me realize we need to double back.

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You know, sitting and thinking and having something triggering your brain, that's how Gautama invented Buddhism, Dan.

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So I think you're about to really crack the case.

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I think we may.

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Now, of course, that also led to the genocide in Myanmar right now, so there's that.

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The Rohingya...

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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Oh, fuck.

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No, not great. Not great.

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No.

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What I'm saying is let's go back in time and kill Gautama rather than Hitler because that would solve the real problem.

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Oh, sure, yeah. Great, great.

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I don't stand behind that, but I do want to play this clip for you and discuss it because I'm not sure if you've even listened to the episode in question of this.

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I did.

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All right. Prove it.

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I don't remember a goddamn thing.

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Well, good.

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You were just talking to Cthulhu. What am I going to pay attention to then?

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This is going to be fresh for you and maybe a repetition for people who listen, but it still will set the stage for what we're going to be going over.

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Okay.

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Paul, we're going to go to Georgia and talk to Paul.

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Paul, thanks for calling. You're on the air worldwide.

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Hello?

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Yes, sir, go ahead.

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Yeah, I just want to bring up a point.

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Steve Vicinich came on yesterday on David Knight's show and said this whole thing didn't happen. Are you aware of that?

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Yeah, I think it's preposterous. I've watched the raw footage. I've talked to folks that were there.

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You can't fake people dying and bleeding out, and he can have his opinion. I can have mine, but I don't buy into that.

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Well, it's almost like a disinformation campaign. Is he still working for the CIA here? I mean, this whole thing...

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Well, I think that's safe to say, yeah.

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All right, if anybody disagrees with Alex, who he has had on the show in the past, that person is now a federal agent.

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Right, doing a disinformation campaign.

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Yeah, that's how that works.

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Again, don't get in bed with psych warfare people. Don't do it.

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He just figured it out.

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I heard that clip, and it blew my mind, because first of all, that was news to me that Steve Vicinich doesn't believe the Las Vegas shooting happened.

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Second, it's crazy to me...

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He doesn't even believe the hurricane happened.

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No, he does.

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And he lived through it.

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He does believe that.

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He was there, and he was like, this is a false flag hurricane.

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The lesson that he took from that hurricane was, mind your manners.

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But he does believe it happened.

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That's the best lesson to take from a hurricane.

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No doubt.

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So I heard that clip, and I was like, I need to think about Steve Vicinich a little bit more.

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I need to explore him.

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Like Buddha.

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And where he was in the game at the end of 2015.

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Okay.

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And before I did that, I decided, hey, I never listened to David Knight's show.

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Why don't I go back and listen to Steve Vicinich actually say that Las Vegas didn't happen.

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You poor man.

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So now you're going to have to listen to that too.

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Fuck David Knight.

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Here are a couple clips from the October 4th, 2017 show, The Real News with David Knight, where Steve Vicinich comes on and says that the Las Vegas attack did not happen.

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Naturally.

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Dr. Vicinich, let's go straight to the shooting in Vegas.

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Your comments.

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Let me tell you, number one, why I can't get on the Internet.

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The reason is very simple.

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I'm being hacked.

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The reason why you're hearing me now is another person's phone call.

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This is part of 9-11.

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They can call it in Thursday, but everything you said, David, is the same thing I said within 24 hours of 9-11.

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My CIA operatives admitted that they did it.

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I have the names of the people.

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If you have the fucking names.

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It's because of 9-11.

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It's a continuation of 9-11.

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It's the same thing as 9-11.

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Right, but he says he has the names of all these people then.

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I implore you, sir.

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Let's get on with it.

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Let's get some Stevie Larry Nicks going on here.

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To quote Barry Manilow, let's get on with it.

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Because we need, I believe that the entire world's security is contingent on you producing these fucking names, Steve.

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Yeah, and who the fuck did 9-11, Steve, huh?

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He knows.

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Huh?

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Who knows?

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Who did it?

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Me and David Bush, Cheney, Chertoff, Giuliani, the Mossad operatives who blew up the building, and Condi, and as well as Colin Powell.

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And this is what happened.

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So what's happening now is the continuation of Sandy Hook false flag, San Bernardino false flag.

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Yesterday in Las Vegas, a complete false flag.

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It was absolute nonsense.

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You could hear the verbiage.

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You could hear the same setup as we had in Sandy Hook.

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The narrative is so predictable that no one was killed.

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There was no shooting.

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And in fact, what happened in the giveaway was this was the greatest killing in the whole time of America.

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That's distinctive of Trump.

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He has to have the most and the best.

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The sad part is that Trump fell into this system and is co-opted by the Department of HS, CIA, and FBI.

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What we need to do in America now is demand the indictment of presidents, indictment of officials.

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I don't know if it'll happen, but this is enough reason to start a revolution.

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Holy shit!

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That's crazy.

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This is, he is the most right ever for the wrongest reason in the history of the world.

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The idea of indicting the president.

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Yeah, it needs to happen.

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And so many of these, look, fucking, it starts with what, Reagan in the Iran-Contra scenario?

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And every president since then should have been put in jail.

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And Larry Nichols in the Iran-Contra scenario.

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Exactly, exactly.

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But fucking Christ, is he right.

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Well, right.

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And he is right for the worst.

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I love it.

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Let's not dally around with the idea that he's right, because the part that he's wrong about is more important, I believe.

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You know what? The thing is, he puts it forward so confidently that while he was talking there was a part of me that was trying to figure out a way that all of these things could be false flags.

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There is not. He is fucking stupid.

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It seems prohibitive in terms of difficulty.

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A lot of work would go into all of this stuff.

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Yeah, there's no doubt. But it is fascinating that his line on it is that Trump has gone south and he's started doing false flags.

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Yeah, and now it's time for a revolution.

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Which is wild.

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It is time for a revolution against Trump because he faked the Las Vegas shooting.

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And he had to.

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And he had to in order to have the largest mass shooting faked in the history.

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At what point do people just-

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I now love Steve Puchenik because that is the craziest bullshit I've ever heard.

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I like to keep in my head sort of a power ranking of my favorite crazies on Alex's show.

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Steve Puchenik is not even in the top five for me.

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I know that.

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We got Hamamoto up top.

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Of course.

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We're going to meet number two on our next episode.

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Of course.

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I'm going to go do a deep dive into this next crazy on our episode that will air at the end of the week.

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But come on.

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Steve is- no, he is just- save your praise until we get through all this.

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Okay, before we even go any further, do you think he's deliberately lying or do you think he's lost his mind?

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I think he's deliberately lying.

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You think he's deliberately lying and blaming it on Trump?

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Yes.

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Okay.

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I think this is psych warfare, quite frankly.

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Alright.

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I also think he's a little bit crazy.

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There's no doubt about that.

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I think he's absolutely insane.

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Yeah, but even so, even in that clip, you heard him still in 2017, Sandy Hook was fake.

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Of course.

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And Alex, by virtue of David Knight, is allowing this to be broadcast on his show, unquestioned.

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Right.

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Here's my theory.

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Operating theory with zero information.

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Okay.

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Alright, and I want to get this out up front.

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That way the rest of the episode can prove me wrong, but I had a good time.

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Alright, sure.

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I think that when Steve Pacanik lived through the hurricane.

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Okay.

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Okay.

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He realized climate change is real.

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And when that happened, it broke his brain because he spent all of his time denying it

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and now for the first time he's confronted with reality and his entire worldview breaks

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down.

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So there's two ways to go.

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You can either change everything you think or you can double down on your conspiracies.

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Let me pitch a continuation of your theory, but a slightly different version.

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Alright.

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So he realizes the climate change is real in the hurricane and decides he's got to do

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his part to get Trump out of there so someone responsible will take over.

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Okay, okay.

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But he knows that the only place he has influence is with a bunch of crazies.

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Right.

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And so the only way he's going to be able to affect change is by making an even more

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insane theory for them to get on board with, and that is Las Vegas didn't happen.

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Okay.

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I'm in.

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Unfortunately, it backfires because the next day Alex Jones disavows him and says he's

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still working for the CIA on his broadcast.

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I don't think that's a bad idea at all.

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So here's Steve talking more about how it was fake.

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This is still from the real news with David Knight.

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Of course.

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There was no death, no killings, no shooter, absolutely nothing.

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And the reason- Wait a minute.

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You're saying there was nobody killed in Las Vegas?

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No.

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Nobody.

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It was basically a total false flag, it was a total Sandy Hook.

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I do not- Even in false flag operations, things still

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happen.

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I also don't like the expression, it was a total Sandy Hook.

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That's grim.

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Look, we live in a world now that is so beyond insane that I can't help but laugh.

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Guys, it was a classic Sandy Hook.

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The fucking most lunatic, like- It's monstrous.

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That's a real thing that somebody said.

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Yeah.

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And there's a number of people who are listening who are probably like, fuck yeah.

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Yeah.

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No.

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Look, if I did that on stage as a bit, that would be so beyond- People would see that

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as the most ridiculous thing that you can possibly say.

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You might get some press.

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And he means it.

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Yeah.

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That would be great.

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I would be on Jezebel as the, this comedian thinks that it's okay to go too far.

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Yeah.

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That whole thing.

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In the next clip I have here from the David Knight thing, I believe this is the last

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clip.

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Yeah.

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I want to be clear because I'm saying that David Knight's being a dick and allowing Steve

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Pechenik to say that Sandy Hook didn't happen as evidence that the Las Vegas attack didn't

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happen.

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And in this clip, it becomes clear that David Knight also doesn't believe Sandy Hook happened.

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Okay.

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I mean, look, they intimidated Alex Jones into thinking that people really died in Sandy

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Hook.

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Now, explain how that happened.

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Yeah.

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I understand.

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I was intimidated that there was nobody was killed.

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None.

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Yeah.

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I wouldn't disagree with you on Sandy Hook, but I certainly think that people were killed

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here.

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It's absolutely.

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That's also insane.

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That's an even more insane thing to think.

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That is an even more insane thing to think that, look, if you believe both were fake,

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at least that makes a certain logic, but if you're like, well, obviously this one is real,

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but Sandy Hook was fake.

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That's insane.

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Well, actually that actually works towards your theory that Steve Pechenik is just crazy

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because then at least his sort of mental illness, schizophrenic break that he's having has clearly

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delineated lines and that is everything is fake, whereas David Knight is clearly not

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crazy.

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He's a liar because he's being like, well, I don't think we can use this one.

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I think that if we say this is fake, we're going to look real bad.

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People have started to pay attention to us.

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We used to fly under the radar and just antagonize people and make them scared.

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Now people like late night shows make fun of us.

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I don't want the world to find out who I am.

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I saw what happened when David Knight, I learned what happened when people realized Owen Schroyer

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exists when he got made fun of by a little girl.

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Do you know what's crazy?

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I finally saw his name in print.

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I swear to God, I have thought you have been saying Owen Troyer this whole time and it's

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Schroyer.

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It is.

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I can't fucking figure out how to speak English, Dan.

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One of the best tweets that I think I've ever put out was that Owen Schroyer is dangerously

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close to people knowing who he is.

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When he got made fun of by that little girl, everyone just laughed, but they don't realize

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like he's an integral part of Alex Jones' operation.

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And he's also a monster.

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Yeah, he has his own fucking show.

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Anyway, let's get through the end of this clip.

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I don't think that he was intimidated.

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I think he's looking at this.

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I think he backed off of it a bit because when you look at these events, it's very hard

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to determine exactly what happened.

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But I certainly believe that Sandy Hook was a full-blown false flag, but I believe that

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people died here based on what I've seen.

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I think there's a lot of witnesses to this event, but thank you for joining us, Steve

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Pacitti.

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So just shuts it down.

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I personally think Sandy Hook was a false flag, but there were a lot of witnesses who

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saw this going on.

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That doesn't make a goddamn lick of sense.

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That's fucking insane.

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It's not good.

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How many witnesses is enough witnesses?

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About a grip of them.

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He's got a grip of witnesses.

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A key grip or a best boy of them?

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Yeah, just a stack of witnesses.

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Who knows?

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It's a stupid line to draw and everyone's dumb.

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And anyway, I went back and I listened to this and I was like, Steve is crazy.

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Absolutely.

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He's lying and crazy.

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Absolutely.

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That's why we can't find the line between which one it is, it's because he's both.

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I think he's gone.

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I think this is a more stringent...

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Completely off the reservation?

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Yeah, this one's out there.

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Well, we know that Steve Pacitti is a really important part of Alex Jones' worldview and

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his support for Trump.

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We know that, but I don't think we've done a good enough job of exploring that.

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So now in the afterglow of Alex Jones realizing that Steve Pacitti has probably been misleading

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him this entire time, I don't think he's doing that kind of work actually, Alex isn't wrestling

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with that.

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But he's saying that Steve Pacitti is running a disinformation campaign on David Knight's

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show.

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I thought it would be at everyone's best interests for us to go back and explore the last two

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appearances of Steve Pacitti in December of 2015 when Alex Jones made the change.

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Now on our last episode from 2015, we talked about how Alex had become fully convinced

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to go with Trump by the last Republican debate on December 15th.

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And I think that we had our date off a tiny bit.

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I think he was already fairly on board by then, but he was presenting it as, now I have

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no reservations about him.

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Because I went back to a day that will live in infamy, December 7th, 2015, the anniversary

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of Pearl Harbor, which is very fitting.

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Oh no.

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Steve Pacitti makes an appearance on the December 7th, 2015 show and this is like the kind of

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stuff that Alex, you get to watch him throughout the rest of this episode getting fooled in

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real time.

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Do you know what's crazy?

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What's that?

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Pearl Harbor did not happen.

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Oh my God.

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False flag.

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Not enough witnesses.

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Do they not realize that false flags still happen?

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Right.

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Like people still die.

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The term comes from like ships that would put different flags on it to make the people

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where you were going think that it was someone else and then they would kill everybody.

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It's from privateers back whenever it was state sponsored pirates, essentially.

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So if 9-11 was a false flag, the tower still did go down.

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Like we didn't all get fucking mesmerized and turned into people.

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This isn't fucking Men in Black.

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Okay?

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No, no, no, no.

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You're not putting a giant on the, okay.

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It's Men in Black too.

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I apologize.

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And to make the argument that Alex does about the Las Vegas attack, one of the things he's

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saying, his mantra now is the target is the motive.

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That's something he keeps repeating over and over again, saying that these white Christian

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conservatives, because he's stereotyping country music fans, they are the ones who are the

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target, obviously the motive was he wanted to kill white Christian conservative types.

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So that's what he's saying.

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And he's making the argument that that must mean that it's liberals and globalists who

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are behind, you know, the Antifa were behind it because they would be the ones who would

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want to kill conservative Christian white people.

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And to that end, I would make the argument, if you had a crazy conservative type, and

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I'm not saying that this is the case, but if you had a crazy militia type of guy, maybe

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someone who listens to Alex Jones and loves the idea of false flags and understands who

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gets blamed for certain things, wouldn't it make sense for that person then to target

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their own people?

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He says that the Democrats are going to do that to gain sympathy.

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He says that the Democrats are going to start false flagging each other in order to blame

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the Patriots.

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So using that same logic, doesn't it make sense that he should consider the possibility

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that some unhinged militia person attacked some group that would appear to be white Christian

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conservatives in order to pin it on Antifa?

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I'm not saying that's the case, but using Alex Jones's stupid logic, that makes as much

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sense as anything he's saying.

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Right.

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It drives me nuts.

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Here's the problem.

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It's crazy.

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That's batshit.

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Right.

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But also, we live in a comic book now, so that might as well, that's far more, like

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I'm far more possibly, no, I know.

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Yeah.

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Because that's fucking insane.

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Yeah.

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However, in the world that we live in, I'm at a place where it's like, a year ago, that's

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fucking crazy, Dan.

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Right.

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Now it's like, there's a 12% possibility that did happen exactly the way you described it.

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I think it's lower than that.

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I mean-

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But the only point I'm trying to make is that Alex is like, he ascribes all sorts of nefarious

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motives to one side and then doesn't think that, oh, the people listening to me might

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think, oh, that's a good idea, and then go do it.

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But that's the entire point of, so the reason that-

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Again, I'm not saying that's what happened.

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But look, we're getting, also, that would be a delight if you were like, this is obviously

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the truth.

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Like if we just go, if we just start going conspiracy theory beyond Alex Jones-

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Sure.

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That would be a delight.

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Yeah.

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I would enjoy that just as much.

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I was starting to flirt with the idea of pretend, like my dad went to Harvard for his dissertation,

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his doctorate.

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No, anyways.

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When I was growing up, when I was super young, we lived in Cambridge and in Boston because

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he was going to get his doctorate in religious studies, and one of the things I was thinking

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about was trying to create an alternate fake reality wherein we were actually there because

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they were doing tests on me in order to create someone who could take down Alex Jones one

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day.

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Jesus, Dan.

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I was thinking about trying to do something like that, and the idea of you saying we should

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go crazy with just lies, I was like, well, I mean, that's an idea.

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But did you succeed?

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Not yet.

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I mean, it's entirely possible you did.

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Who knows?

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Like, who did?

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Look, all time exists in one moment, but-

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That's true.

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Space time.

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Yeah, it's been declassified.

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Of course.

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No, but you're discounting the fact that if Alex did know that that's what could have

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happened and would have happened, then his job then is to pretend that it's not what

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happened.

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That's exactly what happened.

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Exactly.

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Yeah.

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Do you see what's going on there?

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No, I know.

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The more layers we dig deep-

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It's a JICOM nesting doll.

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Yeah.

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It's impossible to get anywhere because you're just walking in circles.

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See, the thing with that is, were that to be true, we only make Alex smarter and smarter

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and smarter.

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Right.

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Whereas we should be going the exact opposite direction.

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I think we are, and these clips will play that out.

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He's not a very smart man.

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But the first thing that I want to do is I want to play this clip.

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This is from the December 7th, 2015 show, because Alex always talks about how it's come

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out that the United States funds ISIS, and I didn't realize exactly where he was getting

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this from, and he makes it clear in this clip, and it's a problem.

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I started seeing in the last few years, though, this whole Islamic State thing and more, really

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being allowed to recruit, being allowed to build up, being funded by Saudi Arabia.

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We and others exposed it.

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Now it's blown up, and I have trouble even knowing where it's all going.

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I don't think the establishment knows.

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I think it's out of control.

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That's why the former head of defense intelligence has come out three times now on television

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in the last two months and said, we were ordered to fund ISIS and Al-Qaeda consciously.

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It's a horrible idea.

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I don't know what the president's thinking.

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Do you know who that is?

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I...

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Rob Steele?

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Michael Flynn.

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Of course.

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So...

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Naturally.

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Do you know what?

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Here's the interesting thing.

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And by the way, I listened to that interview that he's talking about.

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It was on Al Jazeera.

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He doesn't actually say that.

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This is Alex Jones embellishing on lies that Mike Flynn, the guy who got fired from the

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director of national intelligence position, made.

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So it's not good.

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And he was currently working for Erdogan at that point when he's making these claims.

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He's actively an agent for a foreign power who is hostile and a dictatorship.

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Of course.

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But I don't necessarily think that discounts his points.

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Interesting.

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Okay.

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No, I mean...

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We did fund Al-Qaeda.

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So it is not beyond the realm of possibility to imagine that in its early stages we funded

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ISIS.

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That's entirely possible.

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Well...

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Furthermore...

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Before...

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Regardless...

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Before they were the Islamic State.

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Right.

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They were an entity that was actively international terrorizing.

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Right.

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Now, the Saudis almost certainly fund ISIS.

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Probably.

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There is no doubt in my mind about that.

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Most likely.

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Furthermore...

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But the bullshit about us funding Al-Qaeda and stuff like that is it's a completely different

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generation.

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It's a different time.

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It's not like we funded Al-Qaeda in, you know, 99 or 2000.

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No, but that's...

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We funded them when they were fighting the Russians.

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But again, that doesn't necessarily discount what he's saying though.

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Right.

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I'm dealing more with that.

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Or perhaps more with what Alex says he's saying.

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Right.

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And then there's also just the fact that we are constantly making ISIS stronger simply

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by having our dumbass president.

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No, that's true.

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They are recruiting entirely based off that.

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And it's not like they needed it.

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Obama drone-striked the hell out of enough people where they're like, fuck it, we'll

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join this.

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It's like a recruitment plan.

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Yeah, exactly.

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All of our foreign policy decisions in effect end up helping ISIS.

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Yeah, of course.

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But that does not mean that we created ISIS intentionally, it just means that maybe...

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In the same way that like when a car or even a pill to some extent, there is a negative

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side effect that's found out that's going to cause X amount of trouble, and you could

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either recall it or pay people off who it happens to, businesses, capitalism.

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Right.

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They just decide that, hey, we're going to bite the bullet on this and just get sued.

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It's cheaper to settle out of court than it is to change it.

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Exactly.

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In the same way, I think there's probably a foreign policy equivalent to this.

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It's like, we're going to kill a bunch of terrorists, but we're also going to create

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a ton more.

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I think there's probably an equation that people do, and I disagree with their math

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probably, but that's probably the decision.

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I think it's exactly what they want.

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Look, nothing makes the gun companies more money than whenever a mass shooting happens.

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Right.

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I mean, bump stocks got sold out immediately.

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Immediately.

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In the same way, it makes perfect sense that nothing makes military contractors more money

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than more terrorists.

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And nothing makes our GOP congressmen more electable than pretending that they're fighting

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against terrorists.

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So they have to create them.

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America creates its own enemies by being fucking stupid.

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That is a big part of it.

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That's what we are.

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So again, I don't necessarily discount what Michael Flynn says in that regard because

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first off, who gives a shit?

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He's going to jail.

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Probably.

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He knows that.

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He has to know that at this point.

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Seems bad.

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His goal is either to be pardoned or to fucking go all out, right?

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So why not?

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And this is in December 2015 though, that he's saying these things.

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We've got to remember that we're back in the past.

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This is before he's even been named Trump's national security guy or anything like that.

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He had to have known he was going to jail.

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There was backroom dealings.

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There's undoubtedly connections that have already been forming.

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Roger Stone and him have been talking and shit like that.

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There had to have been a point where he was like, ooh, I'm doing a lot of illegal shit

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right now and I am not doing a good job covering it up.

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It is crazy I've gotten away with it this far.

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Yeah, exactly.

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You ever have those moments where you sit down and you're like, fuck, I should be in

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prison.

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I've committed massive international fraud.

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He's playing with house money, the fact that he's not in jail at this point.

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Right.

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But be that as it may, let's put a pin in all that.

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I get what you're saying.

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I don't disagree, but I don't wholly agree either.

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But it's immaterial to what we need to get through today.

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Fair.

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We're going to talk a lot about Steve Pechenik.

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He comes in in this December 7th, 2015 episode to shit on Obama.

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But I have asked repeatedly our intelligence community to stand up and stop the president

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of the United States, be it Bush, Cheney, Clinton or Obama.

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Obama has been a disaster from day one.

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His history has been nothing but a contrived absurdity about a CIA operative born of a

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CIA grandmother and mother and grandfather who had no background, no experience whatsoever,

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and was voted in without any vetting by the Secret Service, the National Security or any

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organization in the United States.

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You and I could not have become president of the United States the way Obama did.

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And what did he do?

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Yeah, he would have to be elected to the State Center.

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He created a false flag and a stand-down issue with the killing of Osama bin Laden, which

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never occurred.

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So another thing that was said.

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So literally, Steve Pechenik does not believe anything is real.

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He might be a nihilist.

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He believe in nothing.

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Yeah.

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I mean, or just like a solipsist.

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He wasn't there.

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Yeah.

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And what didn't happen?

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Well, in 2015, he has to know that he's full of complete bullshit on that one.

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Like there's no way that he could even pull up any evidence to support those dumb bullshit

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claims.

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Well, the idea that Obama wasn't vetted at all is nonsense.

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Insane.

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That's complete nonsense.

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He was already...

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He's been in government.

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And not only that, like, look, Obama was a not good president.

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He was a...

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There have been worse.

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Oh, absolutely.

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But it's not like he was up there with FDR or nothing like that.

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No.

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And you could make a very compelling argument that his response and his indecision in regards

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to so many things is the reason that we have Trump.

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Totally.

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And he was a huge proponent of neoliberalism, which has destroyed the world.

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So the idea that he is a CIA operative and Pacanik wants our intelligence community to

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have more control over who becomes president.

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I think so.

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Is not good.

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Yeah.

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That's very not good.

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And the fact that he's saying these things and Alex is just sort of like, you're a genius,

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is kind of troubling because they don't really unpack that idea that these deep state people

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should have control over that.

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Which seems like something Alex would be against, but...

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Furthermore, the idea that we want our intelligence community doing anything is very scary when

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you start to consider how utterly incompetent and stupid they all are.

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If you think about, look, we should have probably killed Fidel Castro 60 times and they failed

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every single time.

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Like with cartoonish Bond villain plans where they're like, we're going to put poison in

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his drink.

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And it's like, what are you guys doing?

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It was a better time though.

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That was our intelligence community.

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That's more fun.

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That is our intelligence community.

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It's more fun.

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I know.

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But look, all I'm saying is if Putin can kill people in the UK easily, our intelligence

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community is terrible at this.

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But I, I, I, I, it's fine.

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Yeah.

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I don't have a rebuttal to that.

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I was just thinking that it's probably easy to kill anybody anywhere, quite frankly.

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But they're bad at it.

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So the idea that they're all of a sudden successfully pulling off Las Vegas, the biggest mass shooting

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in history, boggles my mind.

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There's a difference between like a dissident who's in a different country and a head of

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state.

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Do you mean an ambassador?

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Sure.

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There's a difference between an ambassador and the president or whatever position Fidel

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Castro had.

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I mean, if you're killing people, you're killing people in a different country.

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Yeah.

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Well, an ambassador doesn't have as much security as say, Fidel Castro.

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I understand, but I don't know.

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I still think it could be done.

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There's shades of it.

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And if you're trying to bring in the idea of Las Vegas stuff, like that would be not

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that hard to pull off if you were a secret clandestine organization.

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Really?

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Well, look, I'm not saying that that was the case cause I don't believe it was, but if

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you were some sort of secret organization that has unlimited funding, the idea of a

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lone wolf killing type of thing, like that doesn't seem like it would be too hard to

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pull off.

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Okay.

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So you're a JFK truther?

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No.

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Mm.

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Back.

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It was Bush.

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And to the left.

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It was Bush.

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It was Bush.

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Yeah.

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It was Bush who killed JFK?

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Go watch Dark Legacy.

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Now that's my favorite conspiracy theory yet.

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It was H.W. Bush.

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Who wouldn't become vice president for 20 more years.

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But he was in charge of the CIA at the time.

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That's true.

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But come on.

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I don't, I don't believe that's necessarily true, but it's an interesting theory.

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Anyway.

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All right.

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Speaking of interesting theories, we've heard that Steve Pechenik doesn't believe Sandy

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Hook.

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I mean, fuck it.

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It might as well have been Hoover.

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He probably could have pulled it off.

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Probably.

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Although he couldn't even get MLK to kill himself.

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So then maybe he was incompetent too.

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You're so frustrated with me.

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Sandy Hook.

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You, you love.

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Sandy Hook.

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You love, you love Cthulhu because you just get to talk.

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I like a, I like a balance.

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I like having you here to, you know, to have conversation with, but I don't fucking like

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every single sentence interrupted.

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I mean, look, I got to get a word in edgewise.

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You got plenty words in edgewise.

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Hey, take any edgewise word you want.

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But when I say in this next clip, generally that's a cue that I'm about to say something.

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I'm sorry.

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You're just moving along pretty quick.

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We're fucking 35 minutes in already.

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We're four clips in.

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All right.

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All right.

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I apologize.

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So in this next clip, we found out earlier that Steve Pechenik does not believe that

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Sandy Hook happened in 2017.

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See what he said in 2015.

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President of the United States was created false issues and not only in Benghazi, not

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only in Osama Bin Laden, but in Sandy Hook.

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The way he says Osama Bin Laden there is kind of like a political Don Demello.

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I think of Osama Bin Laden.

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Anyway.

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Sandy Hook was par excellence, the description of a non-existent killing of a so-called Asperger's

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individual who supposedly killed 22 kids and several adults with a lot of machinery and

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a lot of heavy equipment.

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It was nonsense.

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So he's pretty consistent.

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He's said that Sandy Hook was fake for a long time.

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And Alex didn't push back on that at all, just sort of accepted it and like, eh, moving

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along.

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So the reason that I'm pulling this episode and then one other one when we're talking

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about Steve Pechenik's role in this whole thing is because it becomes abundantly clear

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when you listen to this December 7th appearance and then we're going to listen to the December

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29th appearance, you really start to get all the pieces come into play about Steve

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manipulating Alex.

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And there's a couple of moments where Alex, I think he sees through it a little bit.

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And then he just squashes those fears or like, I'm being fucked with.

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Okay.

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Now there's a couple of moments that'll be very clear to you.

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What is the end game though for Pechenik to go full on with Sandy Hook trutherism?

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You know, he's manipulating Alex, we got that.

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That's all he's, he's just sowing chaos.

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Well, he's just a fucking horseman of the apocalypse.

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I think that populations are much easier to control and they're scared.

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And when they are distrustful of authority and that sort of thing.

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And so if you want to, I mean, Steve Pechenik writes books and stuff like that, that he

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sells.

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I'm sure there's some interest in that, but then also just pushing through, you know what?

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I don't know.

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Couldn't it be?

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That's a, that's a good question.

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I don't know.

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Cause it doesn't seem like it's a purely financial motive.

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It doesn't seem like it's, it's not clear.

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He has a vested interest in Trump getting in, but he doesn't seem like he's not as much

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of a bigot as a lot of Alex's other cronies.

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Yeah.

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But what does he get?

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Like, so Trump did get elected.

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What is he getting now that he would have gotten like stolen valor a little bit?

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So this is just him wanting to get a hand job?

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Like what are we talking about?

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Well, but I mean, if you're going to make the argument that you think he's crazy, then

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the idea that like he's crazy enough to just want everyone to think that he's changed the

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world, that could, it could be just ego.

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That's entirely possible.

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I don't know.

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The end game isn't as clear as it is about people like Larry Nichols.

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Like Larry Nichols is really easy to see through.

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He wants to destroy the Clintons.

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That's basically, that's it.

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That's the primary motivation for him.

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It's kind of boring in that regard.

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Well, it's not boring in terms of the witch stuff.

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No, that's true.

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But then there's other people who it's clear that like, okay, Trump needs to get in because

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it will aid a rollback of civil rights.

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It will aid a rollback of taxes on the rich and stuff like that.

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Yeah.

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Steve is, it's not as clear.

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No.

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I think he's playing a really interesting game, but yeah, I don't know why.

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The why is not clear.

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Maybe, maybe.

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Is it really just, he wants, so regardless of financial gain, which I mean, he's going

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to get some, the more he appears on these shows, I imagine.

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Is it really just, he wants attention?

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Like is he just another...

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He's lonely.

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Is he just another narcissist?

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It's possible, but I think also he might also be being manipulated in some ways.

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Like I don't think that he's as manipulated as Alex, but over the course of this, I think

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you'll start to see little indications that it's possible that other characters we know

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are working a lot of angles.

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By whom?

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What are you talking about?

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If Steve Pacanich is getting manipulated, by whom?

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Roger Stone.

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Now we're giving Roger Stone that much credit?

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Let's listen to a few more clips and see where we land.

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All right.

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All right.

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I agree that it's very difficult to say exactly what the motivation or the end game is.

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I think it might be possible that we could sum it up as a drastic change in US foreign

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policy.

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Okay.

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And I think that he might have some softness towards Russia.

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He might be a pro-Russia guy, so it's entirely possible that that's a piece of it.

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I don't know.

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Let's listen to these clips and see if it develops.

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Okay.

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All right.

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So in this next clip, we see just the classic Steve Pacanich-style flattery that is indicative

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that he's about to get Alex into a narrative, that he's like, hey, you need to listen.

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I'm going to lull you into a sense of security with this ass-licking.

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Let me get to the point to the American public.

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You are important because basically you have been the game changer in the entire business

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of the media.

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Now, I've known the media very well from the New York Times, the Wall Street Journal, all

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of them, Roger Ailes.

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Basically their job is to get ratings and to get money for whatever content they produce.

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Your job, which I really didn't know from the beginning, was to assess the facts that

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were out there and thanks to your own intuitive knowledge and sense of righteousness, you

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went on to say, okay, let me hear what the alternatives are and you've continued with

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it.

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And in that sense, to me, you represented the American public, the public I knew, the

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people who worked hard, the people who had to earn a living, the people who went to jobs

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on a daily basis, not the politicians like Hillary.

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So in that clip, he's saying that you have changed the game.

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You are responsible for a change in the game because you're not like these assholes.

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You're the voice of the under-heard people.

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You are the voice of true America, which is exactly what Alex wants to hear.

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That's exactly the sort of thing that gets him hard.

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Yeah, he's a patriot.

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So you're taking some notes there.

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What do you got?

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I just, like, is he in a certain sense actually a game changer in that regard?

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Alex?

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Yeah.

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Unfortunately.

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Yeah.

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Right.

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Like in the, in the same way that, uh, Breitbart and Drudge and all of those guys, and of course

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after the Buzzfeed article that once again proved Milo is a Nazi, which fucking suck

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all the dicks guys.

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Yeah.

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We got some real blowback.

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I fucking nailed it.

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Got some real blowback for calling that one early.

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Trust me when I say somebody's a Nazi.

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Jordan screamed about it and he didn't even know that one of Milo Yiannopoulos's email

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passwords was Kristallnacht or the other one was Night of Long Knives 1920.

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Now that one could have been ironic.

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Yeah, I bet.

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I bet.

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That's a long password.

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Um, so, so if we are going to, if we are going to pull that direction, um, I don't understand

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why it is, or I suppose, I suppose absolutely.

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Pecanik has to tell him that it is everybody else is looking for money.

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He has to tell him that because Alex has to believe that he is getting this money under

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duress.

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Like it always has to be to keep the doors open, right?

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It can't be because Alex is a multimillionaire.

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It can't be because of that.

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It has to be because he's a Patriot because that will fulfill his narrative right now.

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If Pecanik is doing that on purpose as opposed to believing that the next thing that he says

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has to be fucking insane, right?

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Uh, somewhat.

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I mean, you want to hear it?

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Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (00:42:26.940)

Okay.

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And what happened is you allowed a Trump to come in, thanks to Mr. Roger Stone, whom I've

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known about since the Reagan administration.

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And he was brilliant enough to say, you know what, we're going to legitimize the people

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who've been out there called the truthers and the wackos, the 20 million of us who basically

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are saying Bush, Cheney, Obama, you're wrong.

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Not only are you wrong, you're criminal.

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Well, to show you're inside baseball, I didn't know you knew Stone.

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I knew of Stone.

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I didn't know how much high-level stuff he was involved in.

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I mean, Elections of the Third World folks put two plus two together, but he's really

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a really great guy.

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I'm trying to get him back into town next week.

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We're going to get back to the clip, but did you notice where he's like, I didn't know

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that you knew Stone.

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Yeah.

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And immediately after this clip, uh, Steve is like, no, I don't know him personally because

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I think he's started.

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He's known him since the Reagan administration, but he's known of him in that regard.

Unknown Speaker (00:43:27.019)

Well, but I think that Steve is starting to, in this clip, he's starting to realize that

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Alex is starting to put some pieces together and he needs to distance himself from Roger

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Stone because the two of them are playing Alex from different angles.

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That's clearly what's happening.

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Okay.

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But they're not working in concert yet?

Unknown Speaker (00:43:47.099)

Yes, they are.

Unknown Speaker (00:43:48.099)

You think they're working in concert?

Unknown Speaker (00:43:49.099)

Yes, but Alex can't suspect that because if he does, then he'll realize that they're fucking

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with him.

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So...

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That they're using him as a media puppet.

Unknown Speaker (00:43:57.539)

But so you're saying that both Stone and Kuchenik are coordinating?

Unknown Speaker (00:44:01.579)

Yes.

Unknown Speaker (00:44:02.579)

Okay.

Unknown Speaker (00:44:03.579)

They've said to be, they've admitted it since then they have a group called the 45 group.

Unknown Speaker (00:44:08.539)

Yeah, but that was, that sounds like a silly dumb thing though.

Unknown Speaker (00:44:12.860)

It probably is, but it's real.

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It's a thing that Roger Stone and Steve Puchenik and who knows what other people are a part

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of.

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They get together and they strategize and did so during the campaign.

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So obviously Roger Stone and Steve Puchenik do know each other at this point.

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Of course.

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I refuse to believe that that's possible.

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That's not the case.

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Making some assertions that are based on some of the later clips too.

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Right.

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So don't, don't like, you know, don't push back too hard, but at the same time, I understand

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your critiques.

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Yeah.

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And they're fair.

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But you, you...

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Well, you know, I'm always going to come at this from the Occam's Razor perspective, simply

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because...

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What's a simpler explanation than the two of them know each other?

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Like what, wait, I'm talking more about the coordinating together situation.

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Let's finish this clip.

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Okay.

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So the, the, the, the behind the scenes stuff I learned, Trump knows a lot more obviously

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than he, than the public knows.

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And Stone was basically talking about how many really good people in the government

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are basically saying what you're saying, that none of them were ever perfect, but they now

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realize this country is going to be brought down if we don't turn things around and stop

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this hijacking of the government by select groups at the top.

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I agree with you.

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But we get the first intention heard a word of that.

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He was just like, I agree with you.

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No, the only thing, the only thing he's concerned about, because immediately what he says after

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that is, I don't know Roger Stone.

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Yeah.

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That's the thing that he's concerned about is that pushing back against that.

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Because what you heard there at the end of that clip of Alex talking is something that

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he will revisit later.

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And it is a realization that Roger Stone behind the scenes has been telling him verbatim the

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same stuff Steve Puchenik has been telling him.

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Okay.

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That to me indicates coordination.

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That's yeah, that's much more compelling than what we just saw right there.

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So my theory is that Steve Puchenik, I mean, he's been a long time guest on Alex Jones's

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show.

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Roger Stone has not.

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Roger Stone was a part of the Trump campaign and then left in August 2015 in order to try

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and create a groundswell of supposedly not connected to Trump media attention.

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Yeah.

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Well, there's that.

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Yeah.

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I mean, certainly from that Breitbart article, it's tough to get away from that.

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Hard to say.

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So what he does is he has connections with Steve Puchenik.

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He knows Steve Puchenik.

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And he's like, you and I need to work together and we're going to flip Alex Jones.

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We're going to get him on board.

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So Steve Puchenik months before this, this December episode, he came on and said that

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me and some other people have convinced Trump to run for president because he is the one

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who can save the country.

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He planted that seed a couple of months ago in Alex's head because of interactions that

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he's had with Roger Stone.

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The people that he's talking to behind the scenes are Roger Stone and ostensibly other

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people who are members of this 45 group, right?

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That is my belief.

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Okay, then a little bit of time goes on and I imagine, you know, Steve Puchenik is spitting

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the narratives that Roger Stone will end up saying once he shows up, Roger Stone shows

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up and he's like, oh yeah, he says the exact same things that trusted Steve Puchenik say

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and Alex Jones immediately is like, well, it must be true.

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You guys can't be connected.

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You say you don't know each other.

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When in the meantime, it's just a perfectly elaborate, perfectly laid out charade that

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now in 2017 has collapsed because Steve Puchenik has said that the Las Vegas shooting, no one

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died in it.

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And because everyone's paying attention to Infowars or is there not?

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I just don't like, I suppose it's just, I see these two guys as being fucking stupid.

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So the idea that they can successfully pull off this scam.

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What's stupid about, I don't see anything stupid about them.

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Listen to what they say.

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They're fucking stupid people.

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No, cause there's intent behind the things that sound stupid.

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That's the thing that needs to be taken into consideration.

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Like if you or I said it or if you walk down the street and you saw some guy in like a,

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I don't know, a Hillary for prison shirt and he's saying it, he's stupid.

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But the progenitor of the information is not stupid.

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They're doing it for a reason.

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Propagandists and conspiracy theorists very rarely exist in a vacuum.

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No of course.

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They're not do it.

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They're not espousing the dumb theories that they espouse for no reason.

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There's something behind all of them.

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Right.

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But they're, they're essentially con men.

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So like are they, and con men's motivations tend towards the selfish.

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It's not as though they are doing this for some sort of a larger good.

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Like they don't give a fuck about the country.

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They don't give a fuck about America.

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But they know that that rhetoric is very powerful.

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Right.

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So you always present it as I care about the country.

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But then do they, do they just want, do they want power?

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Do they want influence?

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Do they want money?

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Probably.

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Do they like, and how does this help them gain this?

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This is what I don't understand.

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Well look at-

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The more, the more, so Roger Stone just wants attention.

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No.

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That's a big part of it.

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All Roger Stone wants is for people to look at him and say, look at, he's got a tattoo

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of Nixon on his fucking back.

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All he wants is attention.

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I think that that's a big part of it, but you have to consider that, you know, he's

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been in business with Paul Manafort as Rogers, or as Alex even slips in there, he, he's been

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involved in third world country elections.

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He has, he has interests that are not abundantly clear without digging too deep into them.

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Right.

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That probably they all stand to gain an amazing amount of money through Trump being president.

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They all know that they can use him.

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But that's such a convoluted Rube Goldberg machine of making money.

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Well, maybe some of them had their backs to the wall.

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Maybe there was no other option.

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People like Mike Flynn probably didn't have another option.

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Right.

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Paul Manafort in over his head probably didn't have another option.

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I don't, I don't buy that.

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There's so many other options.

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There's so many other, they, they already have influence and name recognition within

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DC.

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You owe millions of dollars to a foreign power that wants their money back.

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What do you do?

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You can influence trade in order to get your debt forgiven.

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Wait, Stone and Manafort owe men?

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That does.

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Really?

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Yes.

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Didn't you do, there was an article that came out recently about how the, the, I didn't

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know he owed money.

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I thought he just made money off of the prevailing theory is because he owed a bunch of money.

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Uh, I can't remember the guy's name that he owes a bunch of money to, uh, but it was involved

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with that, uh, uh, the direct guy.

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I can't remember how to say that Russian name, but he's the guy who the emails showed that

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he was offering private briefings to.

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And the prevailing theory was that money is super easy to trace.

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And so he was offering these things in exchange for debt forgiveness because that would be

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impossible to trace.

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Okay.

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So there are situations like that.

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I don't know the financial status of Steve Pechenik.

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Right.

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I don't know what he has his fingers in the pies of, but you have to assume with a lot

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of these people, that is what's going on.

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They're desperate.

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Right.

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And it's so hard for me to jump full force into this because again, it sounds like a

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fucking comic book.

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Like this does not sound like it would happen in reality.

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Now then again, of course, Trump is, Trump is the president, so fucking who knows what

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could happen.

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But it's, it seems just so insane to me that that would actually happen in real life.

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Just because at the same time, these guys seem so, I don't know, either, either they're

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amazing at their jobs or they're terrible at their jobs.

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There's no, there's no middle ground with these fucking idiots.

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Right.

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So here's the article about Paul Manafort.

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A very effective way to conceal payment.

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We now know more about why Manafort offered private briefings to a Russian oligarch.

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Paul Manafort offered private briefings on the Trump campaign to a Russian oligarch in

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hopes of resolving a business dispute, a new report says.

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The dispute erupted as a result of a failed 2008 business deal.

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Manafort's representatives say the offer of private briefings never materialized, which

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is irrelevant in terms of his motivation.

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Former Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort offered private briefings about the campaign

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to Russian oligarch Oleg Deripaska in hopes of resolving a years long business dispute,

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sources told Bloomberg on Wednesday.

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The dispute stemmed from a failed business deal the two pursued in 2008 involving a Ukrainian

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TV company called Black Sea Cable, according to Bloomberg.

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Legal complaints filed by Deripaska's representatives in the Cayman Islands in 2014 say he gave

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Paul Manafort $19 million to invest in the company, but the project fell through and

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Manafort all but disappeared without paying back Deripaska.

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Deripaska's representatives were openly accusing Paul Manafort of fraud and pledging to recover

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the money from him as recently as early 2016, according to the Associated Press.

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But they reportedly backed off on accusations shortly after Manafort joined the campaign

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in the spring.

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So you have situations like this.

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That seems pretty open and shut then.

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Or at least it's it's fucking you need a good excuse if it's not the truth.

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No, that's obvious.

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That's obviously what happened.

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Right.

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Right.

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Any any other conclusion is outside of the pale.

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It would be baffling.

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Another conclusion.

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Yeah.

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So what I'm saying is that we have these things that are starting to come up.

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And who knows?

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I like I said, I don't know Steve Pachanik's game in it as a whole.

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I don't know exactly what Roger Stone's hand is in it.

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Right.

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Well, I mean, the lifting of sanctions on Russia, no oil would have netted billions

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of dollars.

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Of course.

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So on that on that end, they could have had a piece of that.

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That's possible or just I mean, it's pretty clear to me, based on Steve Pachanik's things

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that he said, he has a soft spot for Russia and likes them.

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So the idea of being able to work with them more, not being illegal, that might be his

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motivation.

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I don't know.

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But he's doing something.

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He can't jump on board with a global conspiracy whenever we're fighting against a global conspiracy.

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I don't think it's a global conspiracy.

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Somebody who believes in globalists.

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I think it's very localized.

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The whole thing is just part of another larger chain, though.

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Like if you're going to say that Stone and Pachanik are both manipulating Alex in coordination

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with each other, then you have to get into the larger group of 45.

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Do they all know about this coordination?

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It's not a group of 45.

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It's a 45 group.

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There's not 45 members because group of 45 makes it sound like there's 45 members.

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I have no idea how many people are in it.

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But they've talked about it openly.

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This is a Kill Bill volume one, the crazy 88 situation.

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There better be 88 members.

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They've talked about it openly.

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So then you have to say that, well, that entire group is probably at the very least had a

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conversation about it or they've reported on it.

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You got to assume like Flynn and Sessions are probably in there too.

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So now you have Flynn and Sessions who are both coordinating also with multiple different

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governments.

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Well, they have been.

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Yeah, exactly.

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They have been.

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So now we're dealing with a global conspiracy.

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But you're really not.

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And I just don't see how they can successfully pull that off.

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You're not in the same way as the globalist conspiracy that Alex projects, because that

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involves poisoning the water and trying to take away our virility and stuff like that.

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That's the stuff that's bullshit.

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And this is just making a shit ton of money for them.

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All of these things, the motivation is very clearly just selfishness and self empowerment.

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And that is a global conspiracy that's based entirely on that makes more sense than otherwise.

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Still doesn't make a lot of sense, but it makes more sense.

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Is it really that easy?

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It's very frustrating to me.

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Is that what you can do?

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Can you actually just do a global conspiracy?

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If you get enough, if you get enough connections, is it all of a sudden like, hey, let's make

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a billion dollars off of sanctions lifting by electing the worst president in the history

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of the world that takes forever that we couldn't possibly have done that barely happened in

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the first place?

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And a couple of us are flaming bigots, so we'll just distract everybody with all sorts

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of weird taking away birth control and outlawing 20 week abortions and shit like that.

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We'll get everyone hot and bothered and distracted with that while we rake in millions.

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And then the- Or have our millions forgiven in debt.

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It has to be like, if you're going to put that motive in there, it has to be desperation

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because their percentage of success had to have been astronomical.

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Like imagine if our media actually functioned even slightly.

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But that's part of your calculations, right?

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But even a little bit.

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If they had given Trump a billion in free advertising instead of two billion in free

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advertising, would we still be in the same place?

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I don't know.

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You know?

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I don't know.

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I probably, I think so.

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Do you think it was inevitable?

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I think so.

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You think so?

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Probably.

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You think the Trump thing from start to finish was inevitable?

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Maybe.

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I don't know.

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I almost, I can see a situation where that's correct as well.

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I think we'll know more as time goes on, but I think it's entirely possible.

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Yeah.

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I mean, in terms of Cambridge Analytica, in terms of the micro-targeting of people with

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ads, in terms of these Russian companies buying weird ads that seem to have to do with our

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domestic issues, trying to cause people to be racist or try to inflame people's racism

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towards Trump or to get them towards Trump by inflaming it.

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I think that a lot of those things do make it much more inevitable.

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I think that there certainly was a way that people could have fought back against it more

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effectively, but everyone was too busy fighting.

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Yeah.

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I just don't like, I don't like that narrative because that is the people with information

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defeating the people without it.

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And I just don't like that worldview.

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Or in this case, it's the people, yeah.

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Or the insanely rich defeating the poor, which makes more sense.

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But the way that they did it was such an effective targeted propaganda campaign that I just don't

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want to believe that people are that good at something like that.

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Well, I think a lot of people are.

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And you've got to consider that Roger Stone is one of the sleaziest players in the game.

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He's the Ric Flair of politics.

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So like, he's dirty as hell.

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And why would you not think that that would be his modus operandi?

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Yeah, of course.

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Why would you not think that pulling off something really fucked up and sleazy is exactly what

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he's all about?

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Like I know that he and Trump have been friends for a long time and all that, and that explains

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sort of his proximity, but his involvement implies much worse.

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Like the idea that he was actively involved in stuff.

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If I'm going to do an autopsy, my first kill as far, not kill, I mean my first like suspect

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or the prime mover, so to speak, is Mercer.

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And I think this will go down in history as the first time that artificial intelligence

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beat humanity.

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That's what I think.

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Didn't Blue beat Kasparov?

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That's not artificial intelligence.

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It couldn't improvise in that regard.

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But I do think that Cambridge Analytica is the secret.

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I think that's one of the biggest pieces, and the Mercers are behind all sorts of shit

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like this.

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But at the same time, I would not put it past the idea that the 45 group might even be affiliated

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with him in some way, Robert Mercer.

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I mean, if we're going to go against a guy who thinks Soros is behind everything, I'm

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not going to insist that Mercer is behind everything.

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However, I do have the inklings of an episode of Doctor Who wherein they go back in time

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and they realize that Mercer is actually just a robot who is being controlled by the silence

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or whatever.

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Well, I mean, everyone, if you haven't at this point, go read that BuzzFeed article

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about the emails that leaked from Breitbart about Milo Yiannopoulos and his connection

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and whitewashing of Nazi and white supremacist sources.

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And then go read the Guardian article about Cambridge Analytica and their intense campaign.

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And put those two together and realize that they're the same people.

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And consider that they are working in allegiance and in concert with Alex Jones and Infowars.

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It's just slightly disconnected because, I mean, look at it.

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Milo's come on Alex's show.

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They're friends.

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They're buddies.

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Right.

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He loves Bannon.

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He thinks Bannon's a genius.

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On a recent episode, he's talking about how the fourth turn is coming.

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That's a big piece of Bannon's ideology.

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Yeah.

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So like all of this is connected.

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See, I started off with the whole like global conspiracies are dumb and now I'm right in

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a place where it's like all of these, all of these outlets, all of these media outlets

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are connected and creating this loop.

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And they're all funded by rich old white billionaires.

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And Betsy Devos who can go fucking hang herself.

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Sure.

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I hope she dies.

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I really hope she dies.

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Well, I have some good news.

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Like like Scalise.

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So, in that last clip, one of the things that we lost track of.

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Yes.

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That was really important is that Steve Pachannik knows that Alex Jones got information from

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Roger Stone.

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Yes, absolutely.

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And that Roger Stone got him the appearance with Trump.

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Right.

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And there's a implication that he should know that.

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Alex has never said that on air.

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And the fact that Steve knows it means that he knows.

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So that suggests that Roger has told Steve.

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So little.

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Or at least somebody in the, there's a middleman.

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There is a connection between the two.

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So now we've had Steve butter up Alex.

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He's had him, he's flattered him a bit and now he flatters him a little bit more.

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And in this clip, he does something very intentional and we'll talk about it on the other end.

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This cannot continue.

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We do not have a Congress, a president, or a military and intelligence that is viable

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and concerned about our national security.

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And that's where America has to have the American Revolution in a way that's productive and

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constructive.

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Why you are important and why Trump was important is you are the game changer.

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You are the expression of that American Revolution in the 21st century.

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To allow the truth to come out, St. Augustine said, don't worry about the truth.

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Let it do what it does best to destroy those who distort the truth.

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So what he does there is, first of all, it's interesting that he says that why you are

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important and Trump was important using the past tense for Trump is very strange.

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I think it might've been an accident, but the other thing is that he inexorably ties

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Alex and Trump together as being the forces of this new revolution.

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So at this point, Alex is still not really, like he hasn't come out gung ho for Trump.

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Right.

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Yeah.

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Pechenica is putting the two of them together as being proponents of this American Revolution,

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this 1776 2.0, that puts into Alex's brain, we are of the same ilk.

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Yeah, yeah, we're bras.

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So I mean, like December 1st of 2015 is when Trump came on his show.

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And that is, you know, seven days before, oh, I'm sorry, December 2nd is when he came

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on.

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I mean, he knew on December 1st on the show, he's talking about how I got a big guest for

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tomorrow.

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It's gonna be big.

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I don't want to tell you who it is, wink.

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But then on the third, he goes so far as to still say that he loves Rand Paul, he supports

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Rand Paul, but that Trump is okay.

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Right.

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And it was cool that he came on his show.

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Right.

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So four days.

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Well, that's a false flag.

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Four days before this, he is still saying the same stuff that we'd already heard.

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And even after Trump had been on, he didn't go full on.

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I don't think that was actually Trump.

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I think that was a crisis actor.

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It could have been.

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Check his earlobes.

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Yeah, exactly.

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So Steve is needing to connect them even further in order for this to really this point to

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get home.

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Yeah.

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And that's that's the job he's doing on this December 7th episode.

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He's tying them together.

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Your fates are entwined.

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You are the game changer that will help bring the American Revolution to pass.

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That's fucked up.

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That's really hard to like, it's hard to hear that and be like, I can't do it.

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What's really interesting to me about that is it seems as though everybody or not everybody,

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but everybody who's trying to influence things and everybody who is looking at things from

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a, you know, I don't know if you want to say that Pechenik is rational.

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He is making the same point that I would be making from a different perspective.

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But the system is utterly and completely broken.

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It is destroying everything.

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So his his point is we need to destroy the system and rebuild it.

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So if we're going to go with that as his motive, then the only the only difference between

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he and I is spectrum.

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I think the system needs to be broken down and rebuilt in order to benefit the poorest.

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And he disagrees.

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He thinks it needs to be broken down and rebuilt to benefit the wealthy only.

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So but what boggles my mind about those people is that it is already done.

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So what is it that he wants to how is it that you can break down and rebuild the system

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to benefit the rich even more other than creating a new feudal society?

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I think that might be it.

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He wants to be he wants to have his own, he wants a protectorate in Florida is what you're

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saying.

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Larry Nichols said, you know, if you're in the Senate, you become a duke.

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He was actually bluffing.

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It's just if you're rich, you become a duke.

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Yeah.

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He wants to become a vassal.

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Right.

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I don't know.

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Interesting.

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I don't know.

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It's tough to say.

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In this next clip, the last one we've got from December 7th, again, a day that will

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live in infamy.

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Alex almost realized that he's being fucked with.

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He almost realizes.

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See if you can give me the high sign.

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If you can tell where Alex almost gets it.

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And then it's like, no, you're great, Steve.

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And I just want to say to Dr. Patchenik briefly and get his brief response.

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He's got to go.

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We've got to go.

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He was on a few months ago and he said, you know, the CFR and all the rest of it, I fed

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the line that Jeb Bush should run, knowing that once he got back in, we use 9-11 on him.

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And then I see Trump start using 9-11 on him.

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And then I have some discussions.

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I'll just leave it at that.

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And that's indeed what they're doing is basically baiting the media in to attack him as a 9-11

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truther.

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They're going to destroy the Clintons and the Bushes with it.

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But they were smart enough.

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It got real big.

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And then crickets, no stories, 2000 plus stories and then no stories.

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The word went out, shut that down.

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So now obviously I can let everybody in on the hat trick because, you know, now the.

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This particular cast of the fishing rod lure was somewhat successful, but not fully successful.

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Plus it's good to let them know that they're not the only ones that play games.

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OK.

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So I'll just leave it at that.

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And again, I'm not here with some agency.

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I'm not being advised by people.

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I'm just here.

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Common sense.

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And then I talked to a pachinic and then I talked to some other people and they're on

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the same page and I wonder if they know each other.

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Pachinic says they don't, but it's just people that get what's going on and know how to respond

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to it.

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But that is pretty exciting.

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Pachinic.

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Yeah.

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And they say the stuff and it's like, do they know each other?

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And I'm like, oh, they probably, he said it.

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This noted psych warfare master and the world's greatest dirty trickster.

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The two of them say they don't know each other, but they're suspiciously telling all the same

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things that deny credibility, like beyond the pale of reality, like legitimately Steve

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pachinic ends up saying that Donald Trump just wants to become president to straighten

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things out.

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And then he's going to disappear, right?

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He's going to be president.

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He might even step down after he fixes everything.

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He doesn't want to be president.

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He doesn't want to be president.

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He just knows that they need to fix this Loki and the Oracle are together fighting, fighting

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against everything.

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It's nonsense.

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It's, it's complete bullshit.

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And that moment right there where Alex is like, I got other people telling me the same

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things and I think they know each other, but they don't.

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It's like, dude, come on, do better.

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You're right there.

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I'm watching his face too.

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And he's like, he's like making a face, like he's processing it and he just can't finish

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the job.

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Like

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I mean, pachinics on the show.

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Imagine if, if pachinic weren't on at that moment, do you think he could have made the

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connection?

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No.

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Like he's got a star fuck pachinic.

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Meh.

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So if pachinic's not there.

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Not if he's being rude during a hurricane.

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That's not, but that's after Las Vegas.

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Isn't real.

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Right.

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But that's after the operation in quotes is complete.

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I mean, at a certain point, half like at this point, pachinic might as well say that Las

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Vegas, the city isn't even real.

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I've never been there.

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I can't prove it's real.

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I was there once, but that could have been a false flag.

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Could have been race memory.

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They could have built it just so when I showed up, they were like, oh, look how real it is.

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I've heard of that happening to a lot of people.

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Oh, absolutely.

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Yeah.

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It happened at Sandy Hook.

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Totally.

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I don't even think it's a real city.

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So we're going to talk now about December 29th where Steve pachinic comes back.

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There's going to be two things that happened on the 29th because we talked about the 29th

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already, but we missed some things.

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Christmas.

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Uh, certainly it's coming up or just happened.

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Whoops.

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Just happened.

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Did they do, do they do a Christmas episode?

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Of course.

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There's a war on Christmas.

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You think they're not going to do a Christmas episode?

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I know.

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No, I mean on Christmas.

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Uh, I don't think so, but they did do a new year's Eve episode, which we're going to cover

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later.

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I would, I would give anything to hear them try and, I know, I know, right.

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Or like, or like do a, what I want more than anything right now is the Muppets Christmas

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album, but replace John tender with Alex Jones.

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That would be amazing.

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I want them to do a live re I want them to do a live reading of a Christmas Carol, but

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just rewrite it as they see how that would work.

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Like Scrooge is a fucking maker and this motherfucker is just trying to get a day off.

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What is this?

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Bullshit.

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These ghosts are invading his personal space.

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Oh, absolutely.

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Trying to make him get rid of private property.

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These ghosts are against prosperity.

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A conservative Christmas Carol would have him shoot a ghost.

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No, a libertarian.

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He would, he would pull a shotgun out and be like intruder and shoot the ghost and that

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would be the end.

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It's interesting that you think he's conservative because on this 29th episode, he has something

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to say about his political leanings.

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Sure.

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I just opposed totalitarianism.

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I'm not anti-Islam, but I'm against funding radical Islam to take over the world.

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And all Islam is radical Islam.

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And it comes out of Saudi Arabia.

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And then using the threat of it to take my freedoms and my family's freedoms.

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I mean, I'm a real liberal folks.

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I'm a constitutionalist.

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Absolutely.

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Thomas Jefferson was a liberal.

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I'm that kind of liberal, not the modern liberals with political correctness saying ban.

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It's a, I'm dreaming of a white Christmas and they're actually doing that and saying

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if a white person wants to eat Chinese food, it's, it's cultural appropriation.

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They're actually banning that at universities.

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I mean, you cannot be blacklisted because they said, we're not going to ban Halloween.

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Get over it.

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The people being offended by people in cowboy outfits dressed like a Nazi.

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And I'm a real liberal.

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People call me a libertarian, right winger, whatever, cause I'm pro gun.

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The definitions are all scrambled, right?

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He's a classical liberal, classical liberal.

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So let's get to it.

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Steve Pachana comes back on, on this 29th episode.

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And at this point, Alex has transformed and he has decided he likes Trump as we saw on

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December 15th.

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Absolutely.

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And on this episode is where I tracked it down.

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This is where the soft coup narrative starts.

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Okay.

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So now let's get enjoy watching Alex get lied to in real time and not realize at all how

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hard he's getting played.

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You'll see it all.

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You'll see the moments.

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This is sad.

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This is really fucking sad.

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We have had a military to military relationship with the Russians that has been outstanding

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since 91.

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Now, contrary to the neocons, contrary to the narratives of civilians who would like

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to say they bombed the Russians, what's a Russian conspiracy.

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That's absolute.

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And that's why the political class wants to talk about war with Russia in these debates.

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They're so angry that the U S military is defying them and I'm not trying to lionize

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the U S army especially, but it's exactly what you said here a decade ago.

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They are literally the best Patriots we've got.

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So at this point, what I think is not good.

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What I think is happening there in code is that Steve Puchenik knows damn well that a

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lot of the people in the campaign have connections to Russia and he is pre inoculating the idea

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that, Oh yeah, of course they're going to be attacking Russia there, but it's secretly

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because is he picking 2001 because of nine 11?

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Is that what he's saying?

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91.

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Oh, he said 91.

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Yeah.

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91 after the Berlin wall came down, I believe a few years after that.

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But uh, yeah, I think that what he's doing is he's putting that into Alex's head.

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The narrative in advance that like, look, Russia is great, Russia is great, which Alex

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already is inclined to believe.

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Right.

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That just doesn't make any sense though.

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What do you mean?

Unknown Speaker (01:14:49.140)

Uh, I mean everything point by point, lay it out.

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What do you mean?

Unknown Speaker (01:14:52.720)

I mean, he's saying that, uh, there was a military to military cooperation, the Russian

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military and our military and Putin.

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It's that same thing with Assad.

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It's the same thing with the, the idea that Assad had a trilateral agreement with Russia

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and military.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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You know where that comes from.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:10.340)

Let's finish this clip.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:11.340)

Okay.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:12.340)

You'll see where it comes from.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:13.340)

Okay.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:14.340)

Holding back so much of this.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:15.340)

Well, you have to understand, I mean, I, when I worked in government, my, my primary position

Unknown Speaker (01:15:21.979)

was always as a military officer.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:24.119)

When I went into intelligence, it was trained in that at MIT and at Harvard.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:28.920)

That was a secondary position, but I was proud to be an intelligence and of course then I

Unknown Speaker (01:15:32.979)

am a psychiatrist, but my, my loyalty has always been to the Republic as, as it has

Unknown Speaker (01:15:39.279)

been for Martin Dempsey, as it has been for general Flynn, many other generals who supported

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our American positions and understood that our civilian leaders, remember most of them

Unknown Speaker (01:15:51.000)

have not been to war.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:52.600)

So a lot of these ideas are likely coming from people like Michael Flynn.

Unknown Speaker (01:15:58.260)

So he went to MIT, he was a military officer, right?

Unknown Speaker (01:16:02.800)

Then he went to MIT and Harvard and was trained in Intel.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:06.079)

I guess so.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:07.079)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:08.079)

He's a psychiatrist.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:09.079)

And he's a psychiatrist.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:10.079)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:11.079)

Um, what does MIT have a CO Intel program?

Unknown Speaker (01:16:16.640)

Like what is going on here?

Unknown Speaker (01:16:17.640)

Yeah, I guess so.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:18.640)

I mean, if you base it on a, what we're getting from this, uh, yeah, I guess.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:21.760)

Is that true?

Unknown Speaker (01:16:22.760)

Can I apply?

Unknown Speaker (01:16:23.760)

I, I don't...

Unknown Speaker (01:16:24.760)

I would go to MIT for, for fucking psych warfare.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:28.439)

That sounds awesome.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:29.439)

I think you got to get recruited.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:30.439)

You think so?

Unknown Speaker (01:16:31.439)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:32.439)

Like, like Alex Jones's dad?

Unknown Speaker (01:16:33.439)

Or it doesn't exist and you pretend you got recruited.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:35.960)

Oh, that's another good one.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:37.520)

Is that all you have to do?

Unknown Speaker (01:16:39.159)

How would it?

Unknown Speaker (01:16:40.159)

Oh, these guys are fucking crazy.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:41.560)

It's pretty wild.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:42.560)

If they're successfully pulling this shit off based on all of these lies and all that

Unknown Speaker (01:16:46.960)

shit, God, this would make a great movie.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:49.359)

One day it will be.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:50.359)

This would make an insanely good movie.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:52.079)

One day it will, uh, absolutely.

Unknown Speaker (01:16:53.720)

This is like Tinker Tailor, Soldier Spy, except it's real and, uh, we won't let Gary Oldman

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play any of the characters.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:00.039)

And one, like the biggest mouthpiece of it is often drunk on air.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:06.520)

He's a notorious bigot who likes the taste of whiskey.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:09.800)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:10.800)

So, um, so in this next clip we get, uh, we get to a little bit more of the, uh, the counter

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coup narrative because he mentioned a soft coup in that last clip a little bit.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:20.520)

And that's the soft coup is I guess, Hillary, uh, taking power or something like that.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:27.119)

And then the counter coup is what Steve Pachanik is involved in.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:29.760)

Yes, sir.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:30.760)

Let me throw this in then how, how seismic is it that we've had a huge, basically military

Unknown Speaker (01:17:38.039)

counter coup against the civilian insane people who are like, like a, a compulsive gambler

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at a slot machine trying to conquer and start wars.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:49.859)

They can't win.

Unknown Speaker (01:17:50.859)

I mean, this is such a big deal to have it confirmed that our own military went around

Unknown Speaker (01:17:55.239)

Obama and the neo cons and gave the Russians and the Syrians all the authorization and

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info they needed to defeat Al Qaeda and ISIS disturbing that with a bunch of special forces

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people currently, you name it, they're all completely awake now.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:10.079)

I mean, the system has a big problem.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:12.279)

I don't see how they're going to put this back in the bottle.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:15.039)

Well let me put it this way.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:17.039)

This is, we call, I would call this or we call this a soft coup, soft coup, meaning

Unknown Speaker (01:18:21.840)

that we haven't overthrown the president.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:24.140)

We don't intend to overthrow the president.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:26.319)

There's not a violence involved.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:28.920)

They're not going to be guns in the street, but Alex at the same way you change the narrative

Unknown Speaker (01:18:34.720)

of the media, what's happening now, thanks to the bravery of these men who've been in

Unknown Speaker (01:18:39.760)

our military and our navy and also the men who were fired in Benghazi and a stand down

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in Africa and the naval officers who were involved.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:49.399)

All these people stood out and have their day in court and continue to have that.

Unknown Speaker (01:18:55.399)

Some are heard, some aren't, but you have to remember our democracy and our Republic

Unknown Speaker (01:19:00.199)

is a very fluid entity.

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It's not static.

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It doesn't stay.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:04.760)

The truth is out in the public opinion, the military system wide is saying no to the tyranny.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:11.680)

What is that doing to the more corrupt elements of the establishment?

Unknown Speaker (01:19:15.000)

Well, they're getting scared and what happened is because of your ability to articulate in

Unknown Speaker (01:19:19.880)

our military, willing to stand one percent of the credit, sir.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:24.680)

Well, well, well, well, I'm not, I know, I know Alex, but we've known each other for

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too long.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:30.520)

This is not, you know, we're not bragging here.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:33.199)

We're basically saying because of that narrative, you have a man like Trump come forward.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:38.680)

Whatever he may or may not be, he is changing the entire dynamics of the Republic and the

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way they're getting elected.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:48.119)

Excuse me, Steve, you can keep blowing me, but don't stick your finger up my ass.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:53.159)

Okay.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:54.159)

That feels too good.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:55.159)

At least not on air.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:56.159)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:57.159)

Jesus.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:58.159)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:19:59.159)

He's essentially saying that because of you and your narrative ability, a Trump can arrive.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:02.479)

You have created Trump.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:04.020)

If you created Trump, well, God damn it.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:06.119)

If you don't want to be part of Trump, right.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:08.680)

And you, I mean, he's already jumped on board at this point, so it's, it's, it's more a

Unknown Speaker (01:20:13.640)

grandizing Alex and compromising him with flattery and so you'll, so you'll believe

Unknown Speaker (01:20:18.520)

this soft coon area on a day to day basis.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:21.520)

What does a guy like Steve Pachannik do?

Unknown Speaker (01:20:24.039)

Like just, just like as a, as a day to day thing, but he likes to read, uh, Betty likes

Unknown Speaker (01:20:30.119)

to, I don't know.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:31.119)

He lives in Florida.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:32.119)

He loves golfs.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:33.119)

I don't know.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:34.119)

He's a retired dude.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:35.119)

I don't know what he does.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:38.000)

That's what schemes.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:39.239)

That's what I know.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:40.239)

It has to be, it has to be him like in a fucking office, just writing out reams upon reams

Unknown Speaker (01:20:46.840)

of possible like, or he's got a whiteboard like Steve Bannon, uh, like there's no, there's

Unknown Speaker (01:20:53.220)

no way that he can just come on these shows and pull off this bullshit.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:57.340)

That's one of the PR.

Unknown Speaker (01:20:58.340)

I think it's actually pretty easy when you're dealing with Alex.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:00.539)

If he already likes you and respect so far, we aren't having any trouble.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:03.600)

Well, whenever he likes you and respects you, as long as you keep being like, you're the

Unknown Speaker (01:21:06.640)

most important person in the world.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:08.100)

You're so amazing.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:09.100)

Now let me tell you this.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:10.100)

He's going to go along with it.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:11.560)

He's never going to push too hard back on things with a person like Steve.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:16.199)

So when this falling out about the Las Vegas thing happened, it didn't even happen with

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Alex happened with David Knight.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:23.079)

If he'd said that on Alex's show, I don't know what would have happened.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:25.960)

Right.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:26.960)

That would have been fucking awesome.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:27.960)

Right.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:28.960)

I don't know what Alex would have done to it when a caller asks him about it, but put

Unknown Speaker (01:21:31.800)

in the hot seat that David Knight got put in, I don't know what Alex would have done.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:36.000)

He would have been like, that's interesting.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:38.640)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:39.640)

Probably.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:40.640)

And then hit that fucking commercial button.

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Right.

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Right.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:43.640)

Right.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:44.640)

But jamming that button.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:45.640)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:46.640)

I don't know.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:47.640)

Like with, uh, what you talked about on a Thursday, uh, whenever, uh, who was it that

Unknown Speaker (01:21:50.979)

brought it up and they went immediately to commercial.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:53.479)

Paul Joseph Watson brought up.

Unknown Speaker (01:21:54.800)

Yeah, when he fucking pulled that shit up and, uh, Alex Jones was like, yeah, no false

Unknown Speaker (01:21:59.760)

flag.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:00.760)

Bye.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:01.760)

Bye.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:02.760)

He's really good at that.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:03.760)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:04.760)

Uh, so in this new shooters, I know PJW said it wasn't two shooters, but there's two shooters.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:06.600)

Bye.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:07.600)

I don't want to fire this guy.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:08.600)

So commercial.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:09.600)

Bye.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:10.600)

So, uh, in this next clip, Steve, uh, fakes, uh, his phone being fucked with, uh, like

Unknown Speaker (01:22:15.239)

his tradition on info wars.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:17.199)

They love to do that.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:18.199)

They love to fake hack.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:19.319)

He's being hacked.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:20.319)

Uh, and, uh, at the end of this clip, I think that you can pretty well assume that Roger

Unknown Speaker (01:22:25.439)

Stone and Steve Pachannik are working together.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:27.880)

I think it, I think it comes out in this clip.

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Don't the crooks in the establishment known when they threaten you or me, all that does

Unknown Speaker (01:22:35.020)

is make us double down.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:36.840)

Don't they know our psychology?

Unknown Speaker (01:22:38.119)

No, because they have a, you see, I'm getting interfered with right now just while I'm talking

Unknown Speaker (01:22:44.079)

to you.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:45.079)

They're jamming me on this phone and this is a hard line and I'm not being paranoid.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:48.640)

I just know it.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:50.760)

You hear that?

Unknown Speaker (01:22:51.760)

No, it's probably just on your side or on my side, but they're jamming me on this side

Unknown Speaker (01:22:55.880)

cause this is an undisclosed number.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:57.520)

My friend.

Unknown Speaker (01:22:58.520)

The point is these are our obsessional politicians who've never had real life experience.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:04.520)

Obama is created, developed and nurtured by the CIA.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:08.920)

He doesn't know anything else.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:10.560)

He's not a man of strategy.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:12.399)

He's not a conceptual man.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:14.079)

He's not a great thinker.

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He's a man who's been told what to do, what to say, and he lied pathologically in a way

Unknown Speaker (01:23:21.359)

that absolutely stuns me.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:23.239)

He makes Nixon look like he wasn't the most honest man I've ever met.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:28.439)

Obama has repeatedly lied about it.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:33.239)

Got more time, but then I skipped the break and I'm going to quit doing this.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:35.479)

This is so important.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:36.479)

Let me throw this at you, Dr. Petchenik.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:38.279)

Yes.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:39.279)

Here's an example.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:40.279)

You brought up, um, Mr. Stone with the Trump camp, um, I mean really he's like the head

Unknown Speaker (01:23:46.319)

of the campaign, but he's out of it for other reasons, obviously.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:49.720)

Correct.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:50.720)

I mean this guy obviously stealing time out right there.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:54.560)

Steve Petchenik's response to that is correct.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:57.520)

He's out of it for other reasons.

Unknown Speaker (01:23:59.520)

Steve Petchenik knows what's going on.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:02.039)

Uh, okay.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:04.079)

So that presupposes that Alex has talked to Stone.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:07.159)

Stone has said he's basically running the campaign.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:09.479)

He had to leave for other reasons.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:11.600)

That means that Alex knows the reasons.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:15.960)

Right.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:16.960)

Right.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:17.960)

Right.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:18.960)

I can be more effective outside than inside.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:19.960)

Yeah, of course.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:20.960)

Or whatever.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:21.960)

But that could also just be a, just be bullshit.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:23.720)

Steve, if he didn't have some awareness, his instinctual response would not be to respond

Unknown Speaker (01:24:28.000)

correct.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:29.000)

The fact that he responds correct leads me to believe that he already knew, but at the

Unknown Speaker (01:24:34.439)

same time, okay, I have to, I have to be the worst skeptic here.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:41.399)

All right.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:42.960)

Stone it's entirely possible Stone left because Stone is the worst person to have affiliated

Unknown Speaker (01:24:49.180)

with your actual campaign and they wanted him gone.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:52.960)

Possibly.

Unknown Speaker (01:24:53.960)

Like that's still a possibility and it's entirely possible if that's true for Stone to insist

Unknown Speaker (01:24:59.859)

that he's still running the campaign because he's Roger fucking Stone.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:03.800)

He has to at the very least imagine that in the same way that somebody who's kicked out

Unknown Speaker (01:25:08.239)

of a, like, you know, uh, the fifth beetle is still like, I'm a big reason the beetles

Unknown Speaker (01:25:13.079)

were successful.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:14.079)

You know, that fucking guy, whatever his fucking name.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:16.039)

Yeah, there you go.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:17.039)

Um, but look, all of those, the end result is the same.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:20.119)

It doesn't matter.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:21.119)

You're arguing like a little bit of nuanced semantics, but like the end result of whether

Unknown Speaker (01:25:25.699)

he was kicked out because he's too hot or something like that, or he left strategically

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in order to create a propaganda machine.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:32.640)

The end result is he did create a propaganda machine in service of Trump.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:36.560)

That's true.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:37.560)

So whatever the actual reason for it is, is irrelevant.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:40.199)

He still did succeed in doing that.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:42.359)

I'm so pissed off that Pechenik said that Obama wasn't a, like, say whatever you want

Unknown Speaker (01:25:49.600)

about Obama.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:51.039)

That man was a fucking thinker.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:52.720)

Yeah, he's substantial.

Unknown Speaker (01:25:53.720)

How dare you?

Unknown Speaker (01:25:55.220)

I know, but at the same time, there's a lot of people who come on Alex's show who like

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say stuff like that.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:00.239)

And I'm like, well, that is code for racism.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:02.399)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:03.399)

I don't really think that.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:04.399)

No.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:05.399)

Pechenik isn't doing that out of race.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:06.399)

He's creating a false reality wherein a Trump can be considered.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:09.439)

Trump has lied every day, every fucking day about fucking everything.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:16.119)

And for him to say that Obama is lying and that Obama isn't a great thinker.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:20.079)

Look, one of the big reasons that Obama wasn't a great president was because he was thinking

Unknown Speaker (01:26:24.760)

too much.

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Steve addresses this.

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Oh God.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:27.800)

What a fuck, he's fucking, oh Christ.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:30.640)

That's in the next clip.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:31.640)

I'm going to use this one first.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:32.640)

Okay.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:33.640)

All right.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:34.640)

Correct.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:35.640)

I mean, really, he's like the head of the campaign, but he's out of it for other reasons,

Unknown Speaker (01:26:38.399)

obviously.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:39.399)

Correct.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:40.399)

I mean, this guy, obviously top guy with Nixon, top guy with Bush, senior other folks, I mean,

Unknown Speaker (01:26:43.800)

running major political operations in third world countries, highly respected.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:48.600)

It's obvious what the guy is and does.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:51.479)

He came here before Trump came on and I'm not going to get into the inside baseball

Unknown Speaker (01:26:54.560)

of it, but he briefed me on stuff.

Unknown Speaker (01:26:58.039)

And then when you came on and talked about him a few weeks later, you laid out everything

Unknown Speaker (01:27:02.000)

he said word for word.

Unknown Speaker (01:27:07.439)

But then went on and said, even though I haven't talked to him and see what's happened.

Unknown Speaker (01:27:10.159)

And that's basically what he told me and about this whole Fisher in the system.

Unknown Speaker (01:27:16.760)

And Trump knows that he was explaining, no, Trump's really for real.

Unknown Speaker (01:27:19.600)

We're not going to let them break this country and destroy it.

Unknown Speaker (01:27:21.920)

They're globalists.

Unknown Speaker (01:27:22.920)

They want to roll us into this thing and they want to have a basic corporate takeover and

Unknown Speaker (01:27:26.079)

loot it.

Unknown Speaker (01:27:27.079)

They want to allow it.

Unknown Speaker (01:27:28.079)

And so it was just amazing to hear you then basically say what you knew he'd already told

Unknown Speaker (01:27:34.199)

me.

Unknown Speaker (01:27:35.199)

It's just very, very interesting to realize there's all these different camps in these

Unknown Speaker (01:27:39.279)

different intelligence agencies.

Unknown Speaker (01:27:41.000)

Well, the truth of the matter is there are those who believe in the truth.

Unknown Speaker (01:27:45.399)

We're called truthers.

Unknown Speaker (01:27:46.479)

And I take it not as an insult, but as a point of pride.

Unknown Speaker (01:27:49.720)

And I think your entire audience should take that as a point of pride.

Unknown Speaker (01:27:52.779)

So instead of addressing any issues, he just flatters Alex and his audience.

Unknown Speaker (01:27:56.279)

I mean, there are people that know the truth and we're called truthers mainly because all

Unknown Speaker (01:28:02.039)

we believe in is insane.

Unknown Speaker (01:28:04.720)

So okay.

Unknown Speaker (01:28:05.720)

So Alex even fucking maps it out perfectly.

Unknown Speaker (01:28:09.840)

You told me what Roger Stone already told me.

Unknown Speaker (01:28:12.479)

And you knew that he had already told me.

Unknown Speaker (01:28:13.920)

And you knew he had already told me.

Unknown Speaker (01:28:15.359)

He accidentally phrases it that way when that's supposed to not be what he believes.

Unknown Speaker (01:28:19.119)

He's so close to working this out.

Unknown Speaker (01:28:20.880)

It's exactly right on.

Unknown Speaker (01:28:21.880)

He's so close.

Unknown Speaker (01:28:22.880)

And the whole, like watching it is painful, but watching the actual video of it is like,

Unknown Speaker (01:28:29.119)

it's like, have you ever seen a video of a dog falling off a dock?

Unknown Speaker (01:28:35.340)

Like so there are videos that you can find I've seen once in a while in my life where

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it's a dog who's hanging off a dock and it's scrambling with its paws, trying to stay on

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the dock, but it's lower half is falling off.

Unknown Speaker (01:28:50.720)

It's just, you know, that dog's falling off the dock, but it's trying so hard.

Unknown Speaker (01:28:55.439)

That's what it's like to be, to watch Alex Jones be lied to by Steve and almost get it.

Unknown Speaker (01:29:00.439)

There's those moments where he's like, you're telling me the same things Roger Stone told

Unknown Speaker (01:29:04.760)

me and you, you knew that he told me and like, you're not going to get there.

Unknown Speaker (01:29:10.399)

You're falling off that dock.

Unknown Speaker (01:29:11.560)

What I see is a cat.

Unknown Speaker (01:29:13.359)

I see it's one of those videos of the cat where it's like, I know I can get the top

Unknown Speaker (01:29:17.779)

of that refrigerator.

Unknown Speaker (01:29:19.319)

I can jump from this table to the top of that refrigerator.

Unknown Speaker (01:29:21.920)

And then right.

Unknown Speaker (01:29:22.920)

Is it about to go?

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It's like, Oh, my paws are slippery.

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And it goes right down.

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There are similarities.

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There's similarities.

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Yeah.

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It's just sad to me.

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It's really sad because you, you see the like sort of jump off point of like where

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life could have been entirely different.

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Like the world could be different.

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If Alex Jones had been against Trump, I don't think he would have won.

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And that's not to say that Alex is the reason that I know, I know it's enough of a population

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right.

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That had he, the margins were razor thin.

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And if he had, if he had just like either been neutral, like he was in the Obama McCain

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election or if he had been against Trump because, Hey, they tried to run a psy op on me or something

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like that, it would have made it.

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It would have made a huge difference.

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And quite frankly, I think Alex Jones is going crazy and his entire operation has descended

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into bigot filled madness since 2015, like before it was still bigoted.

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Don't get me wrong.

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But the level is so much higher now and the rhetoric is so dangerous that like, I think

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we could have saved everybody a lot of trouble if that dog would have got on that dock.

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Like if some miracle happened and he would have realized, fuck, Steve and Roger Stone

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are clearly like, why are they pretending not to know each other yet they say, he even

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says word for word, verbatim, the same stuff.

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If he would have just put the pieces together, I'm not going to say he could have saved the

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world.

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No, I mean, well, if we're working under the operating position of neoliberalism is perhaps

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the root cause of all of this, then it would be, well, yeah, well, which is neoliberalism

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isn't good.

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Neoliberalism is, is almost almost as bad as conservatism.

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Correct.

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So, I mean, Hillary, Hillary as president would have had the same result as Obama as

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president wherein we're just pushing these people into more and more of a frenzy.

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So it's entirely possible that this was inevitable, that Trump is the inevitability of a broken

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Democrat or Republican capitalist, what, crypto kleptocratic nation?

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Yeah, maybe.

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Like if we're going to look at this from a tides of history standpoint, which we really

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have to, because if you, if you dive into the day to day, this is all unreal, like this

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is unreal.

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Yeah.

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Like in 2017, we're watching, we might as well be watching fucking gladiatorial combat

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in the goddamn coliseum while, you know, fucking an emperor puts his thumb up and down

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on people.

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It is fucking insane.

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Yeah.

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So look at it from a tide of history standpoint and you see all of these little pieces coming

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together, which perhaps made what is really going on an inevitability.

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And instead of saying that it's Trump or it's Mercer, it's all of these things, you can

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really point to all of these historical inertia factors that are just pushing us ever closer

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to a complete fucking total collapse.

Unknown Speaker (01:32:33.979)

Can I, can I, uh, poke holes in your intellectualizing a tiny bit, please?

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I don't think it matters fair.

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That is a fair point.

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Well, I mean, it is, it is interesting to, and I think 20 years from now, that's a fun

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conversation to have, right?

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But the reality is whatever happened did happen, right?

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And whether, whether Trump and this sort of, you know, like you described kleptocratic,

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uh, unhinged, unhinged meaning in the way I'm using it, unchecked capitalism, no, not

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even that, like untethered to ideology, even really.

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It's not even like, it would be easier if he was just a white supremacist, right?

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Because then it'd be like, Oh, that's what you believe in, right?

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As opposed to like, I'm going to take advantage of some of the, I mean, I have leanings towards

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white supremacy.

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I'm gonna take advantage of that block as best I can.

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Uh, the, the untethered ideological, uh, steal everything, uh, gin up and really excite these

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dangerous conservative, uh, mill, uh, militia types.

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Whether that's inevitable, doesn't matter because the Mercers did do this, right?

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Alex Jones did do this.

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Trump is the person I am so mad that Barbara club and the 45 club is in play.

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If Barbara Tuchman wasn't like in her seventies, God damn it, she would write the greatest

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book about this.

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Also, I will, we're not going to live that long.

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I will write, it takes a while to write a book.

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I will write it.

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If people just fucking donate and not have to have a job.

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Yeah.

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I have a lot of thoughts.

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Anyway, we have one more clip of Steve Pechenik before we get into something that I think

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is fun.

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And then a is a little bit of a departure to end the episode, but here is the last clip

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of Steve Pechenik and again, Alex does not get the picture that he's being played.

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Whoever Trump is, he is a force to contend with and he will not tolerate this kind of

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stuff.

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I'm going to give out some not secret stuff, but I'm going to give out just to just the

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facts.

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This is now out.

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I was told months ago that Trump would go after Hillary on the rape stuff, uh, with

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protecting Clinton.

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I was told that they were waiting for them to attack on nine 11, uh, and think Trump

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was weak on that.

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Trump's ready to just absolutely annihilate them with it because they don't know they've

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lost all credibility.

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Also just fun to remember that on nine 11 Trump's response was now my building looks

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bigger.

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He said that on air when he was interviewed on the TV news.

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Now I have the tallest building in New York.

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Yeah.

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And so the idea that he could be like, your brother was president on nine 11 like, well,

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what did you actually say?

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Like the idea that that's a good trap, I don't know if it necessarily is.

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There are no traps.

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There is nothing.

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So how fucking fun would it have been if Alex Jones is fantasy scenario that Roger Stone

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has clearly fed him.

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They're like, they're trying to get, they're trying to lure jab into this so Trump can

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be like, what am I building?

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Seven.

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Right.

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Right.

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Right.

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If that became the debate, holy shit, that would be amazing.

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Then I would have voted for Trump.

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I don't know.

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Let's get through the rest of this clip.

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Okay.

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And Trump basically has been recruited by Patriots.

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He didn't want to do it by the way.

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On a political, what they know could be a suicide mission and, and, and people put real

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real statesmen.

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Don't tell you all this stuff, folks.

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Okay.

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I mean, all the other people are cowards.

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They can be intimidated.

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Whatever you want to say about Trump, he, he, believe me, they wouldn't let me know

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some of this stuff.

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If it wasn't the case, they wouldn't lie to me like they have recruited him on a suicide

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mission to try to save America.

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Trump believes the narrative.

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The narrative is real.

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It trumps all these other fake people.

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We've got a bet on it.

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And then you came on when I hadn't even gone, talked about the shed or had Trump on and

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you already basically knew all about it, but not even though you knew him, you understood

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the narrative because it was the truth and a way out of it.

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And I am, I'm so fortunate as America isn't and you are to have Trump come forward, spend

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his time, his energy, his money.

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He doesn't need to do this, but he sees, and this is a very smart individual.

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I'm not talking only book smart.

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He's incredibly shrewd.

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He understood what happened in nine 11 because he knows Silverstein.

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He knows the world trade center better than anybody who cares.

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Why would he know the world trade center better than everybody, anyone other than abject hatred

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for it.

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So then again, I mean, you saw that right there.

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There's a, he almost got it dog dog just fell off the dock.

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See the thing is he was told Trump is going to go after nine 11 Trump is going to go after

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the rapes.

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Obviously Roger Stone told him, obviously somebody in the campaign told him it was Roger.

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So I think that's the only person, I think that's the only person that he had access

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to at this point.

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Yeah.

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You've sold me on the two of them working together.

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Oh shit.

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It's fucking obvious.

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Why did you fight with me so much at the top of the, cause we didn't know.

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I didn't know the rest of the part and I just don't believe that people are successful.

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I would like to, I would like to tell you that an hour and 20 minutes ago I said a lot

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of this is about clips that I'm going to play and what's the show?

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I wait for an hour and 20 minutes to talk.

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It's been like 10 months of us doing, you have to know that I have a plan.

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I'm not going to make a bold assertion at the beginning.

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I'm not going to back up.

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See, now this is why we have the open of, you know a lot about Alex Jones and I don't

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know anything about Alex Jones.

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That's my job.

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Fair enough.

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So, uh, I think we can put the baby to bed, uh, in terms of Roger Stone and Steve Pachannik

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we're working together pretty early on and I am.

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Is there any way that we can prove that concretely?

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Uh, without hacking their emails, no.

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See that's, that's the thing because if we actually have concrete proof of that, that's

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a whole different story.

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Well, yeah.

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The problem is it is obvious- I think Alex gives amazing circumstantial

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proof.

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No, exactly.

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It's obvious that they were working together, but we can't pull up, look, if we're in court,

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no judge is going to be like, well, obviously Alex Jones' show is a perfect evidence.

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Well, unless I'm the judge.

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And then I'll be like, oh, this is, he's guilty.

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Or if Judy's the judge, I bet we could crush that.

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Or if it's Reinhold.

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Oh man.

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Imagine if we went on TV with Alex Jones as, as like a Judge Judy show.

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Or Judge Mills Lane.

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Knowledge, knowledge fight is suing Infowars.

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Small claims.

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My small claim is that he's made some big claims.

Unknown Speaker (01:39:08.640)

Yeah.

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We would like a couple of grand.

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Anyway, I think we would be the defendants in any suit.

Unknown Speaker (01:39:15.039)

I think he's going to sue the shit out of us.

Unknown Speaker (01:39:16.880)

Oh, absolutely.

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I think once he realizes that conceivably we are the people who are doing the most potent,

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dangerous work about his credibility, I do think he might sue us for playing clips.

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That would be fascinating.

Unknown Speaker (01:39:28.600)

I want to, can we represent ourselves?

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I will.

Unknown Speaker (01:39:31.479)

Yeah, yeah, for sure.

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Also, I am-

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I'll be your lawyer.

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You'll be mine.

Unknown Speaker (01:39:35.479)

I am going as a sovereign citizen though.

Unknown Speaker (01:39:36.479)

Of course.

Unknown Speaker (01:39:37.479)

I'd like to say up front, I do not recognize the authority of this court.

Unknown Speaker (01:39:41.359)

I am showing up here as a representative for Dan Friesen, but I am not.

Unknown Speaker (01:39:45.439)

I will be writing my name in lowercase letters.

Unknown Speaker (01:39:47.960)

Thank you very much.

Unknown Speaker (01:39:48.960)

Well, you can capitalize the first letter.

Unknown Speaker (01:39:49.960)

That's not all of them.

Unknown Speaker (01:39:50.960)

Fair, fair.

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Anyway.

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And I do not have a signature and I don't have any fingerprints anymore.

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So Alex Jones, this is a big piece of the 2015 investigation and I think this is actually

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where we'll put it to bed.

Unknown Speaker (01:40:02.880)

Yeah, I think you're right.

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Steve Pacanich, Roger Stone, in league with the mysterious 45 club, 45 group.

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And the extraordinary gentleman.

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Yep.

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You got Sean Connery, Quatermain.

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Yep.

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Naturally.

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Forgot what-

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Dr. Jekyll.

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Dr. Jekyll, of course.

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The guy from 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea, right?

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Really?

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Who's the Indian dude?

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I don't know.

Unknown Speaker (01:40:30.560)

I don't know.

Unknown Speaker (01:40:31.560)

Why would you pay attention to that movie?

Unknown Speaker (01:40:32.800)

I read the graphic novel.

Unknown Speaker (01:40:34.840)

Oh, did you?

Unknown Speaker (01:40:35.840)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (01:40:36.840)

Never did that.

Unknown Speaker (01:40:37.840)

It's all right.

Unknown Speaker (01:40:38.840)

Anyway, we have a little bit of a bonus-

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Tom Cruise from The Mummy, I guess now?

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Sure, sure.

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Russell Crowe.

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We got a bonus here at the end.

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We're done with our 2015 investigation aspect of this episode.

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But in going back through, I re-listened to the December 29th episode.

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And because I did so, I realized that I turned it off too early.

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Because Alex Jones has his friend Kevin Booth on, who is the guy who was Bill Hicks' producer.

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And the two of them are idiots.

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Right.

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Killed Lincoln.

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Right.

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Absolutely.

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So the two of them are on because Kevin Booth has a guest, a friend who he had interviewed

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for an investigative film that he's doing.

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This guy was a gentleman by the name of Dr. Yala.

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And he has done a lot of work in terms of interviewing people who've defected from ISIS.

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And I actually have his bio pulled up here.

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Dr. Yala's research mainly focuses on terrorism, radicalization, and countering violent extremism.

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He has authored and co-authored several articles and books on the subject of terrorism and

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violence including First Responders Guide to Professionally Interacting with Muslim

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Communities, Law Enforcement, Emergency and Firefighters, Understanding and Responding

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to Terrorism, a complete model to deal with terrorism and understanding and responding

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to terrorism.

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Dr. Yala over the years has interviewed cadres representing over 20 terrorist organizations.

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The ISIS defector interviews of late are unique in the world as he was one of the first researchers

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who managed to reach ISIS defectors and persuade them to talk about their stories openly.

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Editorially, in parentheses, I'm going to add this, without torture.

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Most of those were also video recorded for future documentaries.

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Ahmet S. Yala, PhD, that's a real degree.

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He formerly served as...

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He did get it from Sri Lanka though.

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He formerly served as professor and the chair of sociology department at Haran University

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in Turkey.

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Dr. Yala earned both his master's and PhD degrees in criminal justice and information

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science from the University of North Texas.

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Dr. Yala served as the chief of counter-terrorism and operations division for the Turkish National

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Police.

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He's written multiple books and at this point he is in hiding for the most part because

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of the incredibly dangerous work that he does.

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Yeah, because...

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Well, and ISIS wants to kill him.

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He's the cultural revolution.

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He's Dr. Feng Yulan, essentially.

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And ISIS wants to kill him because he has talked to people who have defected from ISIS.

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He knows who those people are and he's gotten information from them that they do not want

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to be out.

Unknown Speaker (01:43:17.960)

Of course.

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Yeah.

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Kevin Booth was on with Alex.

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And the reason that I didn't get to this interview is because they have terrible tech difficulties

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and I thought that they just abandoned the interview.

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I think it was smart for Kevin Federline to change his name after the whole Britney break

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up.

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Papasau.

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I made a big mistake in not covering this interview and I'm going to rectify that now.

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This interview is damning in many ways and I'm going to start it with Alex Jones introducing

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the guest, Dr. Yala, and this is before he allows the guest to talk.

Unknown Speaker (01:43:53.720)

Wait.

Unknown Speaker (01:43:54.720)

So Dr. Yala goes on Alex Jones' show?

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Because of his relationship with Kevin Booth.

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Kevin Booth is doing a documentary where he went to Turkey and done a bunch of research.

Unknown Speaker (01:44:06.399)

So is Dr. Yala an insane person?

Unknown Speaker (01:44:08.600)

It seems so far what you've described to me is somebody who knows what the fuck he's talking

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about.

Unknown Speaker (01:44:13.720)

Let's see what happens when an actual scholar shows up accidentally on Info Wars.

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But first-

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So this is an accidental situation.

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But first-

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Yala did not know what he was getting into.

Unknown Speaker (01:44:23.000)

I don't think so.

Unknown Speaker (01:44:24.039)

But also, here's how Alex Jones sets it up.

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It's important to take note of this because I think he would redo this afterwards if he

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could.

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You have gone into the most dangerous areas in south central LA to Skid Row to make your

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films that have aired on, I mean, you name it, Showtime, HBO, so many other channels.

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Even Drug War 1 and 2 that I was honored to consult on.

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So folks know Kevin Booth is.

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But Kevin recently just got back from Turkey.

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He lives in LA.

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He's visiting family.

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He's a Texan.

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Visiting family out in Fredericksburg.

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And he said, man, I've got incredible stuff from the Middle East.

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And then I was looking at who he was going to bring on the show in about 30 minutes.

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This particular doctor.

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And I was like, wait a minute, Joe Biggs knows who that is.

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This is the guy that's getting ISIS defectors to defect and expose that the West and the

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Turkish government and others are funding him.

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This guy's in hiding.

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This guy's really big.

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He's interviewed him.

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We've got a three minute super cut we're going to play here in a moment.

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So Alex Jones has suggested and presented this as he knows who this guy is.

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Yeah.

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And he's saying that he's exposing that the U.S. and the West.

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He's getting people to defect from ISIS as opposed to interviewing defectors.

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I don't believe that he's getting people.

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He's not convincing people to defect, is he?

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Not that I'm aware of.

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Right.

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I don't know.

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I don't think that's the case.

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I don't think that's the case.

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I think he's researching terrorism and what causes people.

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They play the super cut and he goes into some really interesting ideas about like what are

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the biggest identifiers for what puts someone at risk of being joining ISIS.

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Right.

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And generally it's having a family member who has been killed by U.S. drone strike or

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something like that.

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Yeah.

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Who would've guessed?

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Poverty.

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There's the basically a lot of it is, well, you'd kind of expect that.

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Yeah.

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These are the motivations that end up driving people towards that.

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And he knows that from interviewing the people who have been like, this is too hot.

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I got to get out of here.

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The way we reacted after World War I caused World War II.

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The way we are reacting after 9-11 caused ISIS.

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Right.

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Or even Desert Storm.

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Yeah.

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If you want to go back even further.

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Absolutely.

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But that, I mean, then you get into like a, you know, chicken egg or a chai kong.

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Anyways, America created its own enemies.

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So, but Alex Jones is presenting it as this guy is exposing that the West is funding ISIS

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and created ISIS.

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He does not know that that is not what is going to be exposed in this interview.

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I have two clips.

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They're a little long, but they're necessary.

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And I don't want to deprive them of context.

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This first one I have just labeled, Dr. Yala is not an info warrior.

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Trying to get started here with your incredible historic interviews with these ISIS people.

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Please continue.

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Give us the big picture.

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In one of the interviews with Kevin, you talked about the fact that it's just unprecedented.

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I believe you said that ISIS is being used to basically take Syria away.

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I mean, what's the geopolitical aim here?

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Who's really behind ISIS, sir?

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Okay.

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We had interviewed around 30 ISIS defected as of now.

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And this question was one of the questions I asked them during our interview.

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I have three answers to this question.

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Most of the time, the defectors answered in similar way.

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The first, they are good at Syria and Iran is behind ISIS.

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The second, Russia is behind ISIS.

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And the third, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, and Turkey behind ISIS.

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The ISIS fighters or the terrorists who had been in the field and fought with ISIS think

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that those three countries are behind the fertilizer or forcing factors behind ISIS.

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They think Syria, because Syria and Iran are acting together in the region, and they think

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that Assad is trying to show the whole world that if you do not work with me, you have

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to work with these animals.

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So here, have a good time.

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Agreed.

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The second-

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I don't think there's any evidence that Assad's behind ISIS.

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This is what they say.

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I'm right now talking about the research.

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That was my next question.

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How do you know they have it defected to you to give you this info?

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This is through our connections and my past experience, because I have interrogated and

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interacted with over 10,000 terrorists over the 70 years of time.

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So it is basically based on our experience and also you can see and understand the stories

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are through what they are talking and through their narrative.

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For example, when I asked about Russia, they said there are Russian generals who are at

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the age of around 40, 45.

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They claim that they are retired from Russian military as general.

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They converted to Islam and right now they are fighting for the ISIS.

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And when they describe those generals, they were the ones who were making the critical

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decisions on the battlefield.

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And one of the fighters told me that I never trusted them because they were there in the

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name of Russia.

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I asked them if they were Chechen.

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He said, no, these are real, belong to Russians.

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And they are the ones who were steering us towards the war.

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So I was kind of checking through the interview.

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So he's saying, because his accent is a little bit thick, he's saying that there are 40 to

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45 year old Russian retired military personnel who are directing, who are leading ISIS.

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Some ISIS groups, ISIS battlefields, they are making battlefield decisions.

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He's saying that that is information that he has gotten from defected ISIS fighters.

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And whether or not you want to deem him credible or not is a decision that you have to make.

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Or whether you deem the information that the person is giving him as credible is your decision.

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He is, like I've looked into it a little bit, he does have an incredible track record and

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a 20 year history of interviewing 10,000 terrorists that he's interviewed over the years.

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So he's consistently given three answers.

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It's Syria plus Iran, it is Russia, and it is Turkey.

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And Saudi Arabia, Qatar, and Turkey.

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Those three answers are what he's consistently given by ISIS defectors.

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So you can either accept that as each one of them is getting different information.

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They're in cells as opposed to a unified group.

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Right.

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Or-

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I think that's a big piece of it.

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I think that's exactly what's going on.

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Because ISIS isn't a group in the same way-

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ISIS isn't a thing.

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In the same way that, I mean, this is a terrible analogy to make because Alex would love me

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to make this analogy, but in the same way that Antifa isn't a group, ISIS isn't a group

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where they have like the heads of all the local ISIS chapters meet together.

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It's not a real country.

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It's not a real nation.

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So that's why we can see ISIS taking-

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There's very likely a piece of it that is swayed by Russia.

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Very likely there is a piece that's swayed by Iran.

Unknown Speaker (01:52:15.640)

Well, Syria is absolutely involved there.

Unknown Speaker (01:52:17.680)

Well, and we'll get to that in the next clip.

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He actually has some really interesting proof of it.

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Okay.

Unknown Speaker (01:52:24.039)

Well, it's hard, so then we're talking about if that is possible-

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It is.

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It's entirely possible that all three different types are being accurate.

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Yeah.

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It's entirely possible that what's really going on with ISIS is that it is a loosely

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connected group of people who are then taking responsibility for so many different terrorist

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attacks because they are directed by their battlefield generals, if you will.

Unknown Speaker (01:52:54.960)

And a lot of times they probably end up fighting with each other in ways that are unpredictable.

Unknown Speaker (01:52:58.479)

Yeah, of course.

Unknown Speaker (01:52:59.479)

Do you remember when the NWO happened in the WCW?

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It was pretty like-

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I do remember when they ended up-

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It was like one big group, but then it ended up turning into the Wolf Pack and then Hollywood

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and the Black and White and then the Luchador World Order and the Hispanic group came around.

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I gotcha.

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I gotcha.

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There's something of that.

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It was a central idea to ISIS at one point and then it became fractured.

Unknown Speaker (01:53:23.880)

There's a whole lot of possibilities in terms of this and I don't know-

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Or maybe it's just different groups of people who were looking for funding and different

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people came calling.

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It's possible.

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Like the only way you fight a war on this level is with money and they all need money

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and they don't necessarily work or live together.

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So if they don't have a centralized tax plan or whatever it is you want to go to, they

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all have to have money to support themselves.

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So they all have to find a way to get that money and if their goals temporarily align

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with Russia, they get Russian money.

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It's like doing odd jobs.

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Exactly.

Unknown Speaker (01:53:58.800)

Yeah.

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They're mercenaries less than they are a cohesive ideology.

Unknown Speaker (01:54:03.479)

It's ideologue mercenaries.

Unknown Speaker (01:54:04.760)

Yeah.

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It's like we want to get a caliphate, but we also will kill tons of people for you if

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you want us to.

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Right.

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They're the second sons.

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Right.

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You know the only possibility that's not true in my mind, the only thing I'm excluding from

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my mind is that this guest is misrepresenting his research.

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That's agreed.

Unknown Speaker (01:54:26.880)

He is telling the truth in full blatant disregard for the rules of Infowars.

Unknown Speaker (01:54:32.159)

Now there's a couple of things that I need you to remember that I think might have slipped

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your mind.

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This one, this first one probably not, and that is that Alex set it up by saying that-

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America did it.

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Right.

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America's finding it.

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And that this guest is great.

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He has a great reputation.

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Of course.

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All this stuff.

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The second thing you almost certainly have forgotten, and that is that on December 29th,

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we covered this on the last 2015 episode, it begins with Alex Jones pretending that

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Infowars is being hacked.

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Yes.

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Being hacked by the, he believes that it is the Turkish Gulen people and what have you.

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I need you to keep that in your mind for what is going to happen two clips from now.

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Okay.

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Keep that in your mind because I have a very strong theory about what is actually happening.

Unknown Speaker (01:55:18.199)

Okay.

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And it turns out, I think he might've actually been hacked.

Unknown Speaker (01:55:21.239)

No shit.

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Yeah.

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I will be God fucking damn.

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I think he might've actually-

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So if you have, oh my God.

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So he's got the Turkey guy on there.

Unknown Speaker (01:55:28.720)

The Turkish army is looking for him and they're going to go through that?

Unknown Speaker (01:55:31.840)

No.

Unknown Speaker (01:55:32.840)

Oh, okay.

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Nevermind.

Unknown Speaker (01:55:34.840)

I don't think it was the Gulen people.

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All right.

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I jumped into it.

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I think the suspect is wrong.

Unknown Speaker (01:55:38.840)

Okay.

Unknown Speaker (01:55:39.840)

But let's finish this clip.

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Sir, the only line I've seen on that, doctor, is that the Russians in Chechnya and other

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areas basically try to run the radicals out and just say, get out of the country.

Unknown Speaker (01:55:49.159)

Again, he very specifically said he asked these people if they were Chechens and they

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were not.

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Yeah.

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And they said no.

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And some of them have then been coming to Syria, but I don't even think the CIA and

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others who've been caught up to their eyeballs working with ISIS and NATO have said that

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the Russians, well, that would be full spectrum dominance if the Russians were running ISIS

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and countering ISIS.

Unknown Speaker (01:56:09.520)

Which would be like what you accuse the globalists of doing.

Unknown Speaker (01:56:12.159)

Sure would be.

Unknown Speaker (01:56:14.600)

I don't say running ISIS, but people in ISIS said that those three countries or those three

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groups at least have taken it, you know, they were at least using ISIS for their own causes.

Unknown Speaker (01:56:33.039)

Is that the cut to people?

Unknown Speaker (01:56:34.520)

Oh, man.

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I was about to say, I don't know how ISIS would follow Russians.

Unknown Speaker (01:56:38.319)

I mean, oh boy, do I, I sure know why they would do that.

Unknown Speaker (01:56:43.960)

Well, now let's take a step back.

Unknown Speaker (01:56:46.000)

He listed a total of like eight countries and the only one that Alex is sticking on

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is Russia.

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Right.

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Of course.

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It's the only one that he's like, he does not, he doesn't, he doesn't even really necessarily

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fight back too hard on the idea of Syria or any of these other countries, Qatar, Saudi

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Arabia, obviously Saudi Arabia is obviously Saudi Arabia did

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9-11 and Iran probably is not worth fighting about, you know, like in terms of, but he

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already hates Iran because of the Iran deal.

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So that's fine.

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Right.

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But he finds time in his busy schedule to argue that there's no way Russia.

Unknown Speaker (01:57:20.279)

Well, if there's no way Russia, then there's no way Syria, because that's his, that's already

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his argument is that Syria is Syria is part of Russia.

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So now in this next clip, Dr. Yala pretty much lays out a very concrete case that Assad

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and ISIS are working together based on his experience.

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And do you know what's awesome about somebody who knows what they're fucking talking about?

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When asked a direct question, he says, my proof is the people that I've talked to.

Unknown Speaker (01:57:53.359)

He does not say, I know this is true, right?

Unknown Speaker (01:57:57.979)

He is still saying that he's copping to the idea that like, I'm just reporting what I

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found in my exactly.

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It's entirely possible.

Unknown Speaker (01:58:04.760)

I, my data sample is not everybody, so it's entirely possible that this is not necessarily

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true.

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Kind of what not liars do.

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Exactly.

Unknown Speaker (01:58:13.520)

Yeah.

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Isn't it weird?

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Alex must have lost.

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Alex must've been like, wait, wait, wait.

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You don't know.

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100%.

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His face.

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I don't understand.

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He's flummoxed.

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Well, he was quiet and Kevin booth is there the entire time and he knows to shut the fuck

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up.

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He just brought a chaotic element into Alex's life.

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And he's watching to, Kevin is probably having the time of his life.

Unknown Speaker (01:58:35.079)

Oh, I imagine.

Unknown Speaker (01:58:36.079)

And so I want to also be clear at this point, that last clip, except for when he was dating

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Britney Spears.

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Oh, that was the best.

Unknown Speaker (01:58:42.239)

Oh, so good.

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Super rich.

Unknown Speaker (01:58:44.239)

That last clip, uh, was over Skype and then Skype gets hacked.

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And so they have to do this next, uh, when they come back from commercial, their Skype

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isn't working and they have to use the phone.

Unknown Speaker (01:58:57.039)

And so it sounds a little different, uh, but also it's relevant to my theory.

Unknown Speaker (01:59:01.239)

Now is he, are we confident he's in the United States hiding?

Unknown Speaker (01:59:07.880)

I'm not confident of anything at this point.

Unknown Speaker (01:59:11.739)

We have some technical difficulties with your hand just wherein I knocked over the webcam

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and spilled and spilled a shit ton of monster energy drink.

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So if anybody would like monster energy drink, it is on Dan's floor and leg.

Unknown Speaker (01:59:27.359)

Um, yeah, I, I'm, I'm confident that he's in the United States in so much as I don't

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really care to wrestle with it.

Unknown Speaker (01:59:34.279)

Like I don't want to argue with, I don't disbelieve.

Unknown Speaker (01:59:37.039)

That's not, that's not what I'm saying.

Unknown Speaker (01:59:38.479)

I'm saying more as in if, if we're talking about this, uh, his, if we're saying that

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the Skype was hacked, it is not because he's in some sort of a remote area.

Unknown Speaker (01:59:51.720)

Wherein the signal just may have dropped.

Unknown Speaker (01:59:53.880)

No, it's possible.

Unknown Speaker (01:59:55.119)

Oh, look, I don't have, I don't have a concrete answer on this.

Unknown Speaker (01:59:57.960)

That's entirely possible.

Unknown Speaker (01:59:58.960)

Even if he's in the fucking United States, it could have dropped.

Unknown Speaker (02:00:00.840)

No, of course.

Unknown Speaker (02:00:01.840)

But I want, I'm bringing that up mostly just to keep it fresh in your head.

Unknown Speaker (02:00:05.960)

That's all right.

Unknown Speaker (02:00:06.960)

Uh, so in this next clip, uh, Dr. Yala, uh, he, like I, like I mentioned a second ago,

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he lays out a really convincing argument for why, uh, Assad and ISIS are working together.

Unknown Speaker (02:00:21.720)

And Alex has a very negative reaction to it.

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Of course.

Unknown Speaker (02:00:25.640)

Dr. Amit S. Yala, ICSVE.org, read more on the site, B-I-V-O-L dot B-G.

Unknown Speaker (02:00:33.199)

I got to try to get this guy back up sometime when we're not having Skype problems to really

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do research and then ask him a bunch of hardcore questions.

Unknown Speaker (02:00:41.359)

Um, I mean, I could see the Russians trying to infiltrate ISIS.

Unknown Speaker (02:00:45.560)

I could see the Russians doing something like that, but ISIS defectors telling him Russia

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runs me.

Unknown Speaker (02:00:51.039)

Um, he, I mean, I think he's saying he's done so many interrogations.

Unknown Speaker (02:00:54.159)

He believes these aren't infiltrators or double or triple agents, but look what's happened

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at Guantanamo Bay.

Unknown Speaker (02:00:58.680)

Just basically theorizing what this person is saying when he's made it very clear what

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he's saying.

Unknown Speaker (02:01:03.439)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (02:01:04.439)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (02:01:05.439)

Wild.

Unknown Speaker (02:01:06.439)

I'm not saying he's wrong.

Unknown Speaker (02:01:07.439)

I don't want to spend a little bit of time that we have a base with the doctor to get

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off into that.

Unknown Speaker (02:01:11.279)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (02:01:12.279)

I mean, I think he's, he's telling you what they're telling him.

Unknown Speaker (02:01:14.399)

I mean, you know, I think my experience over there is that it's chaos and that is very

Unknown Speaker (02:01:18.800)

complicated in that you have a lot of people with a lot of agendas trying to get money,

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trying to dominate, trying to create their own things.

Unknown Speaker (02:01:25.279)

And it's, it's a very chaotic situation.

Unknown Speaker (02:01:27.600)

Sure.

Unknown Speaker (02:01:28.600)

Sure.

Unknown Speaker (02:01:29.600)

Well, well, continually, sort of the key points you want to make to the public and folks need

Unknown Speaker (02:01:31.279)

to know, go ahead, doctor.

Unknown Speaker (02:01:32.279)

Okay.

Unknown Speaker (02:01:33.279)

Now, for example, uh, I always questioned why Assad and ISIS are not fighting each other.

Unknown Speaker (02:01:39.399)

They claimed it.

Unknown Speaker (02:01:40.399)

They are there to get rid of the Syrian regime.

Unknown Speaker (02:01:44.920)

So just real quick, what he's saying is that they're not fighting each other.

Unknown Speaker (02:01:48.520)

Well, no, but he's also saying that one of the questions that he runs into when he's

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interrogating, uh, interviewing these ISIS defectors is why are we, why is ISIS never

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fighting Assad?

Unknown Speaker (02:02:00.600)

Which is an interesting question.

Unknown Speaker (02:02:01.600)

Well, I think the obvious answer there is that the rebels are not part of ISIS.

Unknown Speaker (02:02:06.640)

And so if, if ISIS is in Syria, then the American and Russian governments both can say that

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they are fighting against ISIS when in reality what they're doing is fighting against rebels

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who are fighting against Assad.

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So there's a very pro Assad position that both the United States and Russia take in

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order to maintain some sort of stability there.

Unknown Speaker (02:02:29.439)

Whereas if the, the rebels actually got rid of Assad, then Syria is up for grabs at that

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point.

Unknown Speaker (02:02:36.760)

And we all know that Assad and Russia and the United States military have an arrangement.

Unknown Speaker (02:02:40.399)

Absolutely.

Unknown Speaker (02:02:41.399)

But, uh, listen to this very, uh, very concrete example, uh, that Yaela gives that Alex makes

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him freak out.

Unknown Speaker (02:02:48.439)

Right.

Unknown Speaker (02:02:49.439)

In their history, ISIS never fought against Bashar.

Unknown Speaker (02:02:53.960)

Uh, for example, when they captured Tel Aviv, they were running refineries over there and

Unknown Speaker (02:03:01.039)

the refineries were broken, so they talked to Syrian government and Assad send them engineers

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to fix those refineries.

Unknown Speaker (02:03:10.359)

They let Syrian engineers fix the refineries for like a week and then they started to sell

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oil to Assad, to the Bashar regime.

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And some of their fighters started to question this act and they said, how come we are giving

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the Bashar regime the oil, he turns back and kills our people with that oil.

Unknown Speaker (02:03:33.760)

In their history, they never really fought against Bashar, for example, when they were

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going into Raqqa, there were strongholds of Bashar regime.

Unknown Speaker (02:03:49.439)

They say the soldiers split and Bashar left all the weapons and ammunition to ISIS.

Unknown Speaker (02:03:55.840)

And same thing happened in several places.

Unknown Speaker (02:03:58.279)

So there are lots of questions which cannot be answered or understood by even the high

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level ISIS members.

Unknown Speaker (02:04:09.079)

So it's clearly understandable that there are lots of, uh, things going on behind the

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scenes.

Unknown Speaker (02:04:18.399)

Sure.

Unknown Speaker (02:04:19.399)

The head of defense intelligence who just quit a few months ago, went on Al Jazeera.

Unknown Speaker (02:04:24.319)

I don't know if you've seen the clip, doctor, and he said that the US government basically

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funded and helped ISIS, that that was a direct order of Obama.

Unknown Speaker (02:04:33.359)

I don't think so, or I have never heard of this.

Unknown Speaker (02:04:37.840)

I love that.

Unknown Speaker (02:04:38.840)

Mm.

Unknown Speaker (02:04:39.840)

Mm.

Unknown Speaker (02:04:40.840)

I don't like that.

Unknown Speaker (02:04:41.840)

Man, Alex wanted a different outcome in this interview.

Unknown Speaker (02:04:43.680)

So the very thing that he presented at the top of the interview is what this guy is exposing.

Unknown Speaker (02:04:48.840)

He now asks him, but he's like, I have never heard that.

Unknown Speaker (02:04:51.680)

That is crazy.

Unknown Speaker (02:04:52.680)

So he didn't say that it's crazy, but that's the subtext.

Unknown Speaker (02:04:55.840)

So the doctor's point is that when ISIS, uh, took Libyan oil refineries, uh, Bashar sent

Unknown Speaker (02:05:05.220)

Syrian engineers to build those or to rebuild those refineries to fix stuff.

Unknown Speaker (02:05:10.600)

The moment that happened, they started selling oil back to Bashar.

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The people who defected were like, what the fuck?

Unknown Speaker (02:05:18.960)

That's probably a big reason why they, of course, you're selling oil to the government.

Unknown Speaker (02:05:22.640)

The guy who's killing the people that made me want to join ISIS because they were being

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killed.

Unknown Speaker (02:05:28.239)

Right.

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Jesus.

Unknown Speaker (02:05:30.239)

And that's something that he's gotten firsthand from soldiers and it's something that is obviously

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provable.

Unknown Speaker (02:05:36.880)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (02:05:37.880)

And it's something that's obviously true.

Unknown Speaker (02:05:38.880)

Mm hmm.

Unknown Speaker (02:05:39.880)

Okay.

Unknown Speaker (02:05:40.880)

That's not a good sign for Alex.

Unknown Speaker (02:05:41.880)

Alex is not like true things.

Unknown Speaker (02:05:43.119)

No.

Unknown Speaker (02:05:44.119)

And that's why he switches to like, all right, let's fucking just ask the question.

Unknown Speaker (02:05:47.800)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (02:05:48.800)

And Mike Flynn, who didn't quit, he got fired, uh, he retired, he presented as he quit, uh,

Unknown Speaker (02:05:56.479)

and he's come out and said that U S created and funds ISIS and right now I've not heard

Unknown Speaker (02:06:03.039)

that.

Unknown Speaker (02:06:04.039)

I don't know.

Unknown Speaker (02:06:05.039)

I don't know that to be true.

Unknown Speaker (02:06:06.039)

Nope.

Unknown Speaker (02:06:07.039)

That says a lot.

Unknown Speaker (02:06:09.399)

That's anger.

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That's fucking anger.

Unknown Speaker (02:06:12.079)

And then he goes to commercial immediately and he's done with this.

Unknown Speaker (02:06:15.199)

Of course.

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Of course.

Unknown Speaker (02:06:17.199)

So after this, here is his take on, uh, the interview that he just did.

Unknown Speaker (02:06:22.640)

We just had Dr. Ahmet S, uh, Yyla on the broadcast who advises Homeland Security and more.

Unknown Speaker (02:06:30.399)

And he said some things I agree with from the analysis in the clip from your film.

Unknown Speaker (02:06:34.640)

The other stuff he was saying that these quote ISIS defectors tell him no one else is saying,

Unknown Speaker (02:06:41.699)

but if the West can't fix intelligence, they will have people defect who will then go give

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this info.

Unknown Speaker (02:06:48.680)

And, and, and the system has been caught doing that.

Unknown Speaker (02:06:50.359)

I'm not saying he's doing that.

Unknown Speaker (02:06:51.880)

He seems like a nice enough guy and interesting and you know, has, has some of his colleagues

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killed by ISIS reportedly.

Unknown Speaker (02:06:58.520)

But the point is that, I mean, naturally in here, Russia overthrew Libya.

Unknown Speaker (02:07:03.960)

I mean, it's on record that the West did that using Al Qaeda.

Unknown Speaker (02:07:08.399)

It's on record ISIS is Al Qaeda.

Unknown Speaker (02:07:10.439)

Well, would you like to remind people, Al Qaeda is fighting ISIS in most parts of it.

Unknown Speaker (02:07:18.520)

I said, yeah, for obvious reasons, they're not the same group.

Unknown Speaker (02:07:23.119)

Oh, would you like to lay out what those obvious reasons are?

Unknown Speaker (02:07:25.680)

Cause some people might not understand that.

Unknown Speaker (02:07:27.279)

Okay.

Unknown Speaker (02:07:28.279)

So Al Qaeda is, uh, specifically born out of Afghanistan.

Unknown Speaker (02:07:32.079)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (02:07:33.079)

ISIS is specifically born out of Iraq.

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Iraq is the situation that ISIS capitalized on in order to facilitate what they really

Unknown Speaker (02:07:42.720)

want, which is the end of days, the ultimate battle between the West and the Middle East.

Unknown Speaker (02:07:48.920)

Which Bannon and clearly Alex Jones also won.

Unknown Speaker (02:07:51.359)

Exactly.

Unknown Speaker (02:07:52.359)

Now, Al Qaeda is there as more of a freedom fighting organization.

Unknown Speaker (02:07:57.640)

Like that's really their goal.

Unknown Speaker (02:07:59.119)

Well, they've got off track a little bit at times.

Unknown Speaker (02:08:01.359)

Yeah, of course.

Unknown Speaker (02:08:02.359)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (02:08:03.359)

The point being is that Al Qaeda is far, far in a way, uh, interested in avoiding that

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kind of caliphate because that will once again, absorb Afghanistan into something that they

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don't want to be involved in Afghanistan of all the things that Afghanistan is.

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It is a country that truly believes in being its own country.

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It does not want to be part of Saudi Arabia.

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It does not want to be part of all of these different places.

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It doesn't want to be absorbed in them that all of the wars that have been fought in Afghanistan

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have been the Afghani people saying, leave us the fuck alone.

Unknown Speaker (02:08:41.399)

And so ISIS is another one of those invading nations trying to take over Afghanistan.

Unknown Speaker (02:08:47.319)

Al Qaeda has no interest in that shit.

Unknown Speaker (02:08:49.739)

They're ideologically opposed, even though to a dumb dumb, it appears that they're, uh,

Unknown Speaker (02:08:54.319)

well, if your, if your idea is radical Islam is all radical Islam, as opposed to any number

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of Sunni Shiites, uh, Sufi divisions between the, the, between all of Islam, Islam is not

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a consolidated block.

Unknown Speaker (02:09:08.920)

It's like if Protestants, it's like if Protestants and I got a better version, I got a better

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version.

Unknown Speaker (02:09:15.159)

All right.

Unknown Speaker (02:09:16.159)

Alex would love to school you all day talking about how like identity Europa militias are

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different than the Bundy militia.

Unknown Speaker (02:09:21.680)

Of course.

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And stuff like that.

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You talk about how like, Oh no, those people are white nationalists.

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Whereas the Bundies are just about property rights, sovereignty.

Unknown Speaker (02:09:29.439)

Right.

Unknown Speaker (02:09:30.439)

So he would like to sit down and tell you that all day.

Unknown Speaker (02:09:33.319)

But at the same time he would paint with one brush, all of Islam, not even radical Islam.

Unknown Speaker (02:09:38.159)

They're Brown.

Unknown Speaker (02:09:39.159)

Yeah.

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All of it.

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It's just up there all the same.

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His argument is just that, uh, the, the globalists decided to change the name from Al Qaeda to

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ISIS to confuse people.

Unknown Speaker (02:09:47.439)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (02:09:48.439)

Uh, that is, that indicates a lack of reading.

Unknown Speaker (02:09:50.600)

It indicates a lack of global awareness in any way, but you see that you see in that

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last clip, there are so many different sects of Islam in the same way that Protestantism

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isn't Protestants.

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It's fucking Lutherans.

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It's fucking, uh, Pentecostals.

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It's got damn Quakers, like there's so many evangelicals, those fucking monsters.

Unknown Speaker (02:10:11.439)

Like it's all of those things, everything that's not Catholic.

Unknown Speaker (02:10:14.399)

Yeah, exactly.

Unknown Speaker (02:10:15.399)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (02:10:16.399)

And even Catholicism has dark popes.

Unknown Speaker (02:10:18.539)

If you've ever watched the order, I know about Solomon's temple.

Unknown Speaker (02:10:21.760)

No, but Catholicism is in flux and a constant way as well.

Unknown Speaker (02:10:26.840)

Different, uh, different fucking, uh, and you've got like Lutherans that are much closer

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to Catholics than, uh, than the church of England is essentially Catholicism, but, uh,

Unknown Speaker (02:10:37.000)

but with divorce, you have, you have, uh, an acceptance on Alex's part of a wide swath

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of Christian identities and a lack of tolerance in any way for the idea that any Muslim is

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different.

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I mean, he had Laura Loomer on a couple of weeks ago in 2017 saying that there is no

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moderate Islam, it's all radical and that's just fucking that sort of language.

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It's not going to ruin the world, but what it's going to do is it's going to convince

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some people on the fringe who are close to radical Islam to go all the way.

Unknown Speaker (02:11:15.039)

They will hear that and think, Hey, white people think that we're all radical.

Unknown Speaker (02:11:18.840)

I might as well be.

Unknown Speaker (02:11:20.720)

That's not necessarily a solid argument.

Unknown Speaker (02:11:23.079)

No, it's not.

Unknown Speaker (02:11:24.079)

But, but what other purpose does it serve other than to make white people afraid of

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brown people?

Unknown Speaker (02:11:29.199)

Right.

Unknown Speaker (02:11:30.199)

Those two purposes are the only real outcomes out of it.

Unknown Speaker (02:11:32.399)

There's okay, I get the specifics that you mean.

Unknown Speaker (02:11:37.039)

What I'm getting at is more, there is no positive productive outcome that comes out of it.

Unknown Speaker (02:11:41.920)

And there's no reality based outcome.

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I mean, I think the, the single best parallel I have for why Christianity and Islam are

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both stupid and terrible.

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Their religion?

Unknown Speaker (02:11:54.880)

Well, that's part of it, but look at the way that they spread and they destroy things.

Unknown Speaker (02:12:02.760)

Whenever something like for instance, so many different Muslim sects in Indonesia are or

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were very moderate, very less disinterested really in kind of that kind of an evangelicalism.

Unknown Speaker (02:12:17.039)

A lot of those might've been also tempered with Buddhist influences in the past.

Unknown Speaker (02:12:20.199)

Of course.

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And Saudi Arabian Islamic sects have then sent over different people in Indonesia to

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turn them, turn that Muslim situation in the same way they sent them to Africa and fucking

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murdered gay people, murdered gay people.

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All of this same shit is happening because these religions are fucking horrific.

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And that is not to say that everybody who believes in Islam is horrific in the same

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way that everybody who believes in Christianity is, is not horrific, but it is a, it is a,

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an ideology.

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It is a structure, fundamental structure, fundamental adherence to a structure, uh,

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such as religion, any sort of religion, such as capitalism.

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Those sorts of adherences are outdated modes of being, and they only ever breed horror.

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The ultimate end of all of these religions winds up with the apocalypse.

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And then, and if you're, if your religion winds up in an apocalypse, there's always

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going to be a certain group of people who think, well, it's my job to bring it about

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because it's the prophecy.

Unknown Speaker (02:13:35.079)

So it's not as if, it's not as if I'm acting to do it.

Unknown Speaker (02:13:37.760)

That's what the West has been struggling with for the last couple decades.

Unknown Speaker (02:13:40.039)

It's not as if I'm trying to do it.

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It's that I have to do it because God tells me to do it.

Unknown Speaker (02:13:45.840)

And people will always be fucking fooled by idiots like Alex or like fucking, uh, you'll

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have a number of, yeah, yeah, absolutely.

Unknown Speaker (02:13:53.680)

You'll have mouthpieces like Alex saying that like, Hey, whether, whether, you know, revolution,

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revelation is coming true or it, you know, it's just a coincidence.

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This is biblical.

Unknown Speaker (02:14:03.399)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (02:14:04.399)

You know, Obama's the Antichrist and Trump is the Antichrist.

Unknown Speaker (02:14:07.119)

Then George W. Bush is the, like, it's always, this guy is the apocalypse guy, right?

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That rhetoric is unnecessary to deal with the actual problems.

Unknown Speaker (02:14:16.840)

Now at the same time, everyone accuses everyone of calling people Nazis and sometimes they

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are.

Unknown Speaker (02:14:22.020)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (02:14:23.020)

And that's the converse of that.

Unknown Speaker (02:14:24.720)

No, people, some people are Nazis and it turns out a lot of people are Nazis.

Unknown Speaker (02:14:28.960)

So we've got one more clip from December 29th and it's more about Alex being real disappointed

Unknown Speaker (02:14:35.439)

in this interview.

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He thought it was going to go better.

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You thought he was going to have this guest who confirms all his, uh, Michael Flynn based

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should not have gotten an actual scholar should have gotten a fake degree guy.

Unknown Speaker (02:14:45.920)

And then we, he talks a little bit about the hack attack.

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And at the end of this, I will explain why I kind of think he might've actually been

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getting hacked.

Unknown Speaker (02:14:55.119)

Okay.

Unknown Speaker (02:14:56.119)

Uh, and I'll tell you who I think it was.

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We got to stop because I need a snack attack.

Unknown Speaker (02:15:00.279)

You know what I'm saying?

Unknown Speaker (02:15:01.279)

Different hack attacks are being launched.

Unknown Speaker (02:15:03.399)

Some successful, some not successful, uh, against him full Wars right now with them

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posting an article that Irdagun had fled to a U S military base and been overthrown.

Unknown Speaker (02:15:16.600)

Now would you say that's because we're exposing Islamic Caliphate schools in the U S they're

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trying to overthrow Ergon?

Unknown Speaker (02:15:22.399)

Would you say it's because the Syrian, uh, electronic army, which is pretty much the

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Russians keeps posting info Wars links on hacked sites like the Washington post, the

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New York times and Barack Obama's personal Twitter.

Unknown Speaker (02:15:35.560)

I didn't do that two years ago.

Unknown Speaker (02:15:37.359)

I didn't do that a year ago.

Unknown Speaker (02:15:38.600)

I'm not asking the Syrians to do that.

Unknown Speaker (02:15:40.880)

I don't want that type of traffic from your life.

Unknown Speaker (02:15:45.279)

You know, we got our own traffic.

Unknown Speaker (02:15:48.199)

We're not involved in criminal activity now.

Unknown Speaker (02:15:50.840)

They are attacking these countries, so they've got a right militarily to do what they're

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doing.

Unknown Speaker (02:15:54.640)

We're not involved.

Unknown Speaker (02:15:55.640)

I'm an American.

Unknown Speaker (02:15:56.640)

I'm not involved in the agencies, nothing, but I basically talked to everybody because

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this is what's going on in the real world.

Unknown Speaker (02:16:05.159)

And we just had a guest on earlier that, you know, it was just putting out the most ridiculous

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stuff.

Unknown Speaker (02:16:10.319)

I'm nothing against the guy, but you know, the Russians are behind ISIS.

Unknown Speaker (02:16:13.760)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (02:16:14.760)

I mean, we got Tony from Pluto, former head of defense intelligence coming out and saying

Unknown Speaker (02:16:20.279)

two months ago that they were ordered to help create ISIS and protect them and it's wrong.

Unknown Speaker (02:16:24.939)

You didn't say that even in that interview.

Unknown Speaker (02:16:27.640)

So here's my theory.

Unknown Speaker (02:16:29.159)

Okay.

Unknown Speaker (02:16:30.279)

If the Syrian electronic army, as Alex is asserting, was Russia, SIA, uh, what fire

Unknown Speaker (02:16:38.200)

meets gasoline, the Syrian electronic army, these hackers are swinging from the chandelier.

Unknown Speaker (02:16:43.559)

All of their hair goes directly over their eyes.

Unknown Speaker (02:16:46.200)

Nobody knows what they look like.

Unknown Speaker (02:16:47.200)

So if the Syrian electronic army is Russia, which I don't think, I don't think necessarily

Unknown Speaker (02:16:52.979)

it is.

Unknown Speaker (02:16:55.239)

But if it is.

Unknown Speaker (02:16:56.239)

Again, that seems more like a Merck situation.

Unknown Speaker (02:16:58.700)

But if it is, let's allow that to be a possibility.

Unknown Speaker (02:17:01.639)

Who knows?

Unknown Speaker (02:17:02.940)

If that is the case, I would posit that Russia is hacking Alex Jones's show because they're

Unknown Speaker (02:17:08.940)

not idiots and they know what this doctor knows.

Unknown Speaker (02:17:15.520)

Now here's where it gets fanciful.

Unknown Speaker (02:17:17.360)

I don't really believe this.

Unknown Speaker (02:17:18.680)

Okay.

Unknown Speaker (02:17:19.680)

I was going to say, because I recall now that my, uh, or maybe our, our explanation for

Unknown Speaker (02:17:26.760)

their bullshit hacking was that PJ Dubs tweeted out some shit that he should not have done.

Unknown Speaker (02:17:31.319)

Yes.

Unknown Speaker (02:17:32.319)

So they have to claim that it's a hack.

Unknown Speaker (02:17:33.840)

Occam's razor tells us that it is covering their ass cause they got some bad information

Unknown Speaker (02:17:37.879)

of a bad story and were to lend credibility to the idea that they have a Turkish person

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on to talk about ISIS or they got some good information.

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You think Erdogan actually was at that air force base?

Unknown Speaker (02:17:51.040)

Uh, no, no.

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Cause PJW was tweeting about how there was a planned coup and Erdogan was hiding.

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Right.

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Right.

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So it was just, he was just a year off.

Unknown Speaker (02:18:01.079)

Well, it was about six months off.

Unknown Speaker (02:18:02.639)

Yeah.

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And that's the other possibility is that he figured out or somebody gave him the plan.

Unknown Speaker (02:18:08.479)

Pechenik told him a little bit too early.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Any of these things are possible.

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Look, the idea, look, what I want to say is that like, of course I think that they're

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faking the hack stuff.

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Of course.

Unknown Speaker (02:18:20.680)

Uh, but if it is real, I don't think it's Turkey.

Unknown Speaker (02:18:24.319)

Of course not.

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I don't think it's some group trying to pretend to be somebody.

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I think it's, I think of course it's Russia.

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They're there.

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They're at this point hacking everybody.

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This is the end of 2015.

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That's true.

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They're at a, they're in a hack fever.

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They're going crazy with their, their fucking, why not throw it on the list?

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Like they got a whole, they got a whole checklist of people to hack.

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Their campaigns are going buck wild to a certain extent.

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And so the idea that they would be like, uh, he's going to interview this guy who knows

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that some of our retired generals are running ISIS cells.

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Why wouldn't they?

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Why wouldn't they try and fuck with that?

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I mean, his Skype does end up going down.

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That's not proof of anything, but it's kind of interesting.

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But if their idea is to shut down the Skype, that's a terrible idea.

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Like what you would want to do is attempts to shut down the site were unsuccessful.

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Info Wars got too good a security apparently.

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Sure.

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It's fake.

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It's all fake.

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It's all fake.

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It's all fake.

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I was just trying to have fun.

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Yeah.

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Oh well.

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Anyway, the bottom line is that Alex Jones accidentally got a smart person on his show

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and it did not go well.

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Couldn't handle it.

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No.

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I just love.

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I think that Alex Jones' greatest quote of all time will be just says volumes so much.

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It's so clear, so full of shit.

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I still, but the only thing about that is that suggests to me that Alex does believe

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his bullshit, at least in this situation.

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Not to me.

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Really?

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So you think he's, he's angry because he knows not being, no, that's not necessarily anger.

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I don't think.

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No, but I interpret to be, I'm not good enough at this to figure out how we spin out.

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Like that, that, that is frustration as a propagandist, I think that's how I hear it

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is like I've hit a brick wall.

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We're two minutes away from a break.

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Don't know what to do.

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See I thought that this question was going to lead to him saying, well, I did talk to

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one guy who said that the United States is right, right, right.

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But it turns out no, what, what I hear in that is I am not getting what I believe to

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be true to be confirmed by this guy who I have already insisted is an expert.

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He's super credible.

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So either, either I have the choice of, it's embarrassing, believing him and saying, oh,

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that's interesting.

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Or I have the choice of being Alex Jones and being a whiny little bitch about it and kicking

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you off my show.

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Well, I also want to tell you, that suggests belief to me.

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I also want to tell you one other little piece of information that I've withheld.

Unknown Speaker (02:21:22.520)

Okay.

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On the, on the 29th, this interview that went really terrible happened before the interview

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with Steve Pechenik from the 29th.

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Okay.

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So if he was going to question things and be like, like, oh, Russia is, you're saying

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that, you know, there are some Russian forces that are behind ISIS, I've got to rethink

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everything.

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Then he's got to dovetail that into an interview with Steve Pechenik.

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Right after that, I would posit that those moments where he almost realizes he's getting

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played are the aftermath of this interview with Dr. Yala, not going well at all.

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Right.

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And him talking to Steve Pechenik and the kernel possibly of like, is all of this wrong?

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So again, that suggests belief to me.

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His belief has been shaken, not his propaganda.

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And so when he's talking to Pechenik, now he's getting his belief back into it.

Unknown Speaker (02:22:20.639)

All right, Dan.

Unknown Speaker (02:22:21.639)

All right, Dan.

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No, it's true.

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I think I'm shaking your belief that this is bullshit this time.

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No, it's just such complicated bullshit that it's very difficult to unpack exactly what

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is being expressed and what the line is.

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I think it's possible that his belief is being shaken a little bit and Steve Pechenik coming

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on as a little bit of a booster shot in some way.

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Yeah.

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See, that's kind of the narrative that I'm getting out of this.

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It's possible.

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I don't know.

Unknown Speaker (02:22:52.479)

Bottom line is that I believe that December 2015 was a month that destroyed our country.

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Right.

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I think that there was a chance for Alex Jones to become an antihero and he fucking blew

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it.

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He fucking blew it real hard.

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He never had a shot.

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No, I think he did.

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It was too late.

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It was too late.

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No, I think the redemption was possible.

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I think even even a very dumb man who believes that the civil war was about tariffs going

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going through our investigation has made me believe that he never had a chance.

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Maybe maybe that's what that's what maybe if Rand Paul if Rand Paul had at any point

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been one of the top three, maybe we'd be in a different situation.

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But since Rand Paul was down at the bottom and stayed down at the bottom, who else was

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he going to go to?

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I'm crossing my arms right now very aggressively at you.

Unknown Speaker (02:23:50.120)

It doesn't seem very aggressive.

Unknown Speaker (02:23:51.280)

For a couple of reasons.

Unknown Speaker (02:23:52.280)

You're really bad at being aggressive.

Unknown Speaker (02:23:53.280)

Well, I have to hold this mic.

Unknown Speaker (02:23:54.639)

You need to be more assertive with yourself.

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The reasons that I'm doing that are like there have been elections where he's just stayed

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out of it.

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So even if he's not pitching for Rand because he can't stand like if Rand falls out, it

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doesn't necessarily mean that he would just have to choose somebody in an election.

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He's done that in the past.

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So that's one piece why I think he has a chance.

Unknown Speaker (02:24:15.719)

Second, you haven't experienced what I've experienced in terms of listening to nigh

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on hundreds of hours of Alex Jones.

Unknown Speaker (02:24:23.920)

Oh, are you trying to say you're some sort of expert or some bullshit and I don't know

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anything about Alex Jones?

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Ask Gladwell.

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Is that what you're trying to say?

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Are you a 10,000 hour using me?

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I'm close.

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Okay.

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But the reason that I bring that up is that like in my investigation, I've listened to

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a bunch of old stuff too.

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In addition to this 2015 stuff, because every now and again, I've been trying to find like

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stuff from 2008, 2009 that would be a good episode.

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And you see a different man then.

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You see not, I mean still deeply, deeply flawed, deeply flawed, flawed organization, a bit

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of a bigot.

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There's no doubt about that, but you see a completely different person.

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Like there's an episode in 2008 I was listening to the other day where he sings along to the

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Renegades of Funk as they come in from commercial break where he's like actually enjoying himself

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and having a great time.

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On that episode, it's right when Jesse Ventura gets his conspiracy theory show, they're going

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to pilot.

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And so Jesse Ventura is a guest on the show and Alex is like, he's so excited and bubbly

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about the idea that Jesse Ventura, his friend is going to get a conspiracy theory TV show.

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And he's like, look, I don't want to be weird, but you should have me as a sidekick.

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There's a cute bubbly, like laughing, like not fake laughing, like it's real.

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There's a sincere enjoyment of being this guy.

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And I don't feel that anymore.

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I don't feel that in 2015, I don't feel that in 2017.

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I feel like he's a broken disaster of a person.

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And I do think there is a chance for redemption in terms of the lead up to this election.

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We see it very clearly in the stuff that we've gone over on this episode as a bubbling point

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of all the stuff that we've seen in the last 20 episodes of the investigation.

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There are there are forces that are trying to manipulate him.

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There are forces that are.

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And I don't want to take his responsibility out of it.

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He still is to blame for everything.

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But he had a chance to see that Steve Pechenik and Roger Stone and who knows who else behind

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the scenes were lying to him in a concerted effort to get him to be their propaganda mouthpiece.

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And if he had turned face on them, if he had hit the bad guy with a chair, right.

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You know, right.

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There is that possibility.

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If he had given Steve Pechenik a gold star and sent him to his mom or a stunner.

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Exactly.

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Maybe I watched too much wrestling and maybe I watched too much wrestling and there is

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that idea that there is the villain's redemption and the hero's downfall, like all of these

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things are possible.

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But I from everything I can see.

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He had a chance and it was in December and he fucking blew it.

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OK, now here's here's my here's my problem with that argument.

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And that's from a personal place that suggests to me that my parents had a chance.

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I agree to see through that Republican bullshit.

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Yeah, they did.

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They had a chance.

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Of course.

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So now.

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Of course they did.

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See, I just don't think I if I every person watching every person's hinge point is different.

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Like, who knows when it is in your personal in your journey, in your life.

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I think everybody has a moment where they can go super bad or super good.

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And sometimes it's on a small scale, like with your parents, it probably only affects

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you.

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Like, I mean, and some other people around them in their personal life and the rest of

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my fucking family.

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Sure.

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It affects that.

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But that's small scale with Alex Jones.

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He's a propagandist with millions of listeners.

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He had the he had the it's the difference between with your parents.

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It's a twig breaking.

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Yeah.

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And the big scheme of things.

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And with Alex, it's a glacier falling apart.

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I see.

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I just don't think we ever had a chance or Alex ever had a chance.

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The moment the nominee was Hillary, they never had a chance like Hillary.

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But even if it was Bernie, you wouldn't have had a chance either because he's a socialist.

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I don't know if you for him, he could stay out of an election between Bernie.

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No, he couldn't.

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Absolutely.

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His worldview is based on socialism leading to totalitarianism.

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Right.

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He would have to fight.

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But Bernie said shit.

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And Bernie was a white dude or at least Bernie was a dude.

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I mean, he would have gone through he would have gone through the Jew thing, maybe.

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But but that's something that, you know, almost certainly, 100 percent he would have gone

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through.

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It would have been coded.

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But yeah.

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But but that's not a that's not the same thing as Hillary.

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I think I think they never I think the Republicans never had a chance because of Hillary.

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Like they were they were primed for the con man because they were so blinded by their

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hate for Hillary.

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I think there are a lot of people who are like that.

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And Alex Jones, I think that is a I hesitate to say exactly which is not a large piece

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of it, but it is a piece of his journey.

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There is no doubt.

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But I don't.

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But that's that's that to me is wildly simplistic.

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The idea that most of what motivated him was anti Hillary stuff.

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I think that was a part of it.

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But I don't think that the whispers in the ear from Roger Stone and Steve Pechenik were

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like Hillary sucks.

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That's not that sucks.

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Choose Trump.

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That's not what I'm saying.

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I understand that.

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Yeah.

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But I'm saying that his motivation partially is negative Hillary.

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But more of it is pro Trump based on lies that he's been told about what Trump will

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do to the fake globalist.

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What he's going to do in the world stage.

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The idea that he's going to whip everyone in shape and then leave office.

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Like Solon.

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It's nonsense.

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See, I disagree entirely.

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I don't think well, I don't disagree entirely.

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I think my I think my my view on it is, of course, not the simplistic you know, it's

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just that they hated Hillary.

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My view on it is that because of their hatred for Hillary as a linchpin of their belief

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system for 20 years, yeah, that is something that they could not abandon without great

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personal destruction.

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So they were primed for the con man.

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Now let me actually let me actually let me help your argument.

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Yes.

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Of the vicious weirdos, the rogues gallery that Alex Jones has, the one that he has never

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run afoul of and never gotten into any beef with is Larry Nichols.

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Of course.

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All these other people like Steve Pacanik is now on the outs.

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Yeah.

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I don't think that the two of them I mean, we've documented the last like three appearances,

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the two of them.

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Oh, yeah.

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No, it's not gone great.

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And then now he's doing this Las Vegas is fake shit.

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Now it's just like he's still CIA.

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Yeah.

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So I think the two of them are probably not going to be hanging in the near future.

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I'm not entirely sure.

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Ron Paul was on the other day and they had a fucking fight.

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And I don't know if Ron Paul is like, Alex, you're an idiot.

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I don't think that Ron Paul and him are going to be tight anymore.

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Roger Stone's a different quantity.

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He now knows.

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Roger Stone's an amorphous blob of whatever the fuck he wants to say.

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He knows where his bread is buttered and he's in too deep.

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He's a part of Infowars now more than he is a part of Trump shit.

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So he's sort of irrelevant.

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Of all these like old time weirdos.

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Really the one who never is the problem is Larry Nichols and he is the Hillary guy.

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So I mean, it's and it's not just like it's not to say that's the reason the I think that

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what I'm trying to get to is if it's the most attractive, most universal argument.

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It is that.

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But I mean, more of in the house of cards of their belief system, which is nonsense.

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And any little thing, any little thing can be torn down.

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You know, in House of Cards, no, no, no.

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He killed a dog.

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So did Alex Jones.

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Did Kevin Spacey kill Knonk?

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Yeah.

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In that first episode, Kevin Spacey kills Knonk.

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That's what the British that's what the British one was about.

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It was about Alex Jones.

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Yep.

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We cracked the case.

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Absolutely.

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Yeah.

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No, it's like it's like anti Hillary was the cornerstone.

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Yeah.

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If you pull that, then everything falls.

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So they didn't have a chance because they could not pull.

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If you actually get those people to say, well, Hillary would be better than Trump.

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That means Hillary is better than somebody.

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And they cannot believe that they can't abide by that because that would destroy their she

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is the worst human being ever narrative.

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And if that takes that down, then that suggests to them that maybe there is a career politician

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who's better than a non career politician.

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Many of these people, for them to not vote, the people who hate Hillary so fucking much

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for them to not vote against her is insane to them.

Unknown Speaker (02:33:17.360)

Yeah, that's possible.

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That's compelling.

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Which again is why he could not sit out this election.

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Now he's been fighting Hillary for 20 fucking years.

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He hasn't.

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Mm hmm.

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His his associates have.

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He gets distracted at times.

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Right.

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Right.

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Right.

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He's fighting the globalists.

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He's fighting the chief globalist.

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She's also a witch.

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Right.

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She and the Real Housewives of New Jersey.

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No, no.

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It was Linda Bloodworth Thomas.

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Doesn't matter.

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They're all the same fucking design and women.

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Yeah.

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The only rebuttal I would make to that, because I mostly agree with what you're saying, is

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that even if anti Hillary stuff is the cornerstone, the other stones without them, you don't have

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a Roger.

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You don't have a building.

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The other Roger stones.

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Right.

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Ah.

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You don't have a building without the other stones.

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And even if there's one that holds everything up, the other ones are necessary for the construction.

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Agreed.

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And those other ones are I mean, they're all I mean, it's all lies.

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But absolutely.

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No, I guess it's fascinating to me that I mean, I want to get back to the episode that

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we just did.

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Right.

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Because I mean, this this conversation is good and all, but like, it's not as though

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we've it's not as though nobody has ever had the autopsy of people really hated Hillary.

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Right.

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I mean, that's not a little that's not a groundbreaking analysis, Pat, you know, it's been it's been

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covered.

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Absolutely.

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But and I don't discount that at all.

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I think that there is a massive truth to that.

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But the other thing is that it what we what we've just witnessed in this episode is Alex

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Jones is very willing to be lied to and is so opposed to the idea of someone impugning

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Russia.

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Like, I want to bring that back here really quick.

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Yeah.

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In the sense that that is the only thing he really contests in Dr. Yala's true testimony,

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as it were like, he doesn't even rebut necessarily the idea that there were Syrian oil fields

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that Bashar al-Assad sent people to fix so they could sell oil to so ISIS could sell

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oil to course he doesn't even respond to that except to say Mike Flynn says the U.S. is

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behind it.

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Yeah, that's true.

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The only thing he's like, this is stupid, is the idea that Russia is involved.

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Yeah, I'm not going to argue that.

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But to me, that indicates to like.

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It's much more problematic.

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Is it that or is it that he just doesn't know a goddamn thing about the other things that

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he said?

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Like, he doesn't know anything about Turkey.

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He doesn't know anything about Syria, really.

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He doesn't know anything about Iran.

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He doesn't know anything about these people.

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Russia is the only thing that he does think he knows anything about.

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Right.

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The only thing that he does think he has concrete information, people like Steve, because they

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can probably told him things behind the scenes, of course, about clandestine agreements.

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Of course, absolutely.

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So he thinks he has that piece of information, right?

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Which is why he would be he would be confident in fighting back against it on that point

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alone.

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Because if he starts saying Iran and Syria, he's fucking off the reservation, even for

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him.

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You know, if he starts going like, here's my theory on Syria, you're you're done.

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You know?

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Yeah.

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He has.

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Frankly, he has no idea what Bashar Assad actually does.

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No.

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He thinks that he wants to go back to Britain.

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Look, I mean, we're spiraling a lot.

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It's it's.

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It's just the reason it's fucked up.

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Yeah.

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Exactly.

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Exactly.

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It's so fucked up.

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And it's not like.

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I mean, we can come back to this a hundred different times, but it's like.

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OK, I get it.

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Yeah, I'm going crazy.

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Right.

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That wasn't my no, I know tire point, but no, like I get I get the idea that people

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think like I have friends who are like, what are you doing?

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I run into people I used to do stand up with and they're like, what have you been doing?

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Like, I've been studying Alex Jones pretty intensely for the last 10 months.

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Yeah.

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You're nuts to the exclusion of just about everything else.

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Mostly.

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Yeah, absolutely.

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Yeah.

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But the reason is because I am intensely convinced that this is the thread that is the loosest.

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Right.

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It really is.

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Now, granted.

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A thread that's way looser is like if we could hack Breitbart's emails, like, like Buzzfeed

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didn't hack them.

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No, they got those.

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They were linked.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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And if we could get a data dump like that, it would be so much easier.

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Oh, yeah.

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But since we are going on context clues and his actual words.

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Yeah.

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I legitimately think that this is the loosest thread that unravels everything.

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I think that from experience, from listening to him, from understanding what he's talking

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about and people even who like there are so many people who discount Alex Jones and they're

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like, oh, he's just crazy.

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He's just crazy.

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There are people who who who there are people who think that they know something about Alex

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Jones that don't know who Steve Pachannik is.

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Right.

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There are people who think like, oh, yeah, fuck that guy.

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They don't know who they don't know Roger Stone's influence.

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Right.

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That's what I thought earlier.

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Oh, and Shroyer.

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You didn't know how to spell his name and you do a podcast about info wars.

Unknown Speaker (02:38:46.760)

That was more a pronunciation issue, not a spelling issue.

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I've always pronounced it Shroyer.

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I know.

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But to me, I hear Troy.

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That's because Vince Vince Troyer.

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It's your thing of mini me.

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OK.

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All right.

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But like they're they're I'm I'm maybe going crazy a tiny bit.

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But the only reason is I'm 100 percent convinced that these circumstantial pieces of evidence

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build up to a very compelling argument.

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And the compelling argument is that there is a group called the 45 Group that Roger

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Stone and Steve Pachannik have admitted to being a part of on Alex Jones's show that

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are way more interested in Russian interests than they are in American interests.

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And what they have done is concoct a crazy bullshit narrative that they have convinced

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Alex Jones is true.

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And they're using him because I mean, let's go back to our first fucking episode.

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One of the things I made very clear on the first episode is that Alex Jones is incredibly

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talented.

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He's very good at this propaganda game that he plays.

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And I don't I don't I don't take that back at all.

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A hundred and something episodes into this.

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He's very good.

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And they recognize that and are using him as a weapon.

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Now, your point that he had no shot and there's no chance that things could have gone better.

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That is a difference of opinion.

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And you might be right.

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I might be right.

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Agreed.

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It's possible.

Unknown Speaker (02:40:23.079)

Yeah, I'm not going to I'm not going to try and take down your argument either.

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No, it's also a glass half full glass half empty course, of course.

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But what's not is if you were trying to pull off a massive scam, if you were trying to

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do something really fucked up.

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Alex Jones is an amazing person to have on your side.

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Yeah.

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I mean, why wouldn't they get him on his.

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I think our ultimate so clear.

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I think our ultimate disagreement on this is nothing to do with any of the circumstantial

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evidence that we have put together.

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It is that I just have such a hard time accepting that they actually pulled off this Ocean's

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Eleven scam.

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But that's like that's that's where Cambridge, you know, I know that's what I'm saying.

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It's it is such an amazing thing to me that they would actually be able to pull off the

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heist of the century.

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Well, but then steal the presidency.

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Here's the thing.

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They didn't.

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Cambridge Analytica and the Mercers did.

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Yeah, they did the actual bank heist.

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Right.

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Alex Jones is distraction.

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Alex Jones is the person who was running the hey, look over here.

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And the reason that it gives away the bank robbery is because he's so obvious about it.

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Yeah.

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That is the point I'm trying to make.

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I believe that we've accidentally stumbled into.

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Right.

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OK, Ocean's Twelve or Ocean's Eleven.

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I can't remember which movie is which.

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Right.

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But like the people who are actually cracking the safe are Cambridge Analytica, Jared.

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You know, these these folks are the people who are actually the ones who were involved

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in it.

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And Alex Jones is the Casey Affleck.

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The Casey Affleck.

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What's his fucking face?

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Khan.

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Yeah.

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Jimmy Khan's son.

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Of course our analysis winds up being the brother of a famous person and the son of

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a famous person.

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Exactly.

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Which makes perfect sense considering the world we live in, where the brother of a famous

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person and the son of a famous person are fucking us over.

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But if we're looking at this in terms of like, you know, a lot of really serious people only

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want to focus on what happened to the safe.

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Yeah.

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And I think that's a very valid point of investigation.

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And quite frankly, I think it's a part of investigation that I can't help with.

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Yeah.

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And I wish everyone well.

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I wish Mueller well.

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I wish...

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Oh, we're fucked.

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Probably not.

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But I wish everyone who's looking at that well.

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I can't help.

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But what I can help with is review the tapes from the casino where there's people acting

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real weird right at the same time as the fucking bank robbery went down.

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And I can say, huh, interesting.

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Let's listen to what they were doing a couple months before.

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And oh, it turns out they've recorded all the things they were doing a couple months

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before and they're basically laying out everything that ends up happening.

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So we're saying PJW is the guy with a bad cockney accent.

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Is that what's going on here?

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He's Don Cheadle.

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Don Cheadle?

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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He's the demolitions expert.

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It's all gone bawdy.

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All right.

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Great job, Don.

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Look, I don't know.

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I think we're spiraling way out of control.

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I know.

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But I'm just so unbelievably fascinated, horrified by all the stuff that we've talked about.

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And it's such a leap to me.

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It's such a jump that I have to be skeptical.

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Otherwise I feel like I'm going to start getting into a place of magical thinking all the time.

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Totally.

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Skepticism is very healthy.

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Right.

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And I have to push back against this because it suggests a competency that I am just so

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unwilling to accept from all of these people.

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If they were actually this competent, if people were actually this competent, it seems as

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though a lot more would get done.

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But from my understanding of so much of history-

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Where's the competence?

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Well, they pulled off the heist of the century.

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I mean, you're talking about Patchenik.

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You're talking about Patchenik and Stone.

Unknown Speaker (02:44:42.079)

No, I know that.

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But you're talking about them being capable of executing this years-long disinformation

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campaign against Alex Jones without breaking once, without ever breaking character.

Unknown Speaker (02:44:57.639)

You're misinterpreting some things.

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I mean, if Jimmy Fallon can't even go through a single SNL sketch without breaking-

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You're misinterpreting a few things.

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Okay.

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All right.

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But his involvement in this scam is probably much more recent than his entire history on

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Infowars.

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It's not like he was there years planted in advance.

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We're in 2015.

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I'm still talking about that, but we're still talking about the same people being part of

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Infowars now.

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All they needed to do was hit the nozz right at the right time.

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They just had to hit that booster at just the right time, and they did.

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That's the entire race.

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They're still going with it.

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But Stone hasn't even given Alex an inkling of like, hey, by the way, I fucked you over.

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That's because Stone has realized this is a better gig.

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Well, yeah.

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That's true.

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He's realized, I think, that Infowars is where I fucking belong.

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I'm a dirty, sleazy fucking dude.

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This is much better for me.

Unknown Speaker (02:45:54.959)

I make money selling supplements out the ass.

Unknown Speaker (02:45:57.959)

This is great.

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We're conning people.

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Why would I want to be involved in politics?

Unknown Speaker (02:46:00.959)

Yeah, that's true.

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I imagine he's just made the jump.

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That's what it seems to me is what's going on.

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It's much lower stakes.

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It's not going to get him in front of the house fucking intelligence committee again,

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most likely.

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I think that Steve Paczentk has gone off the reservation.

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He's going nuts with the...

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He's doing his own game now to the point where he doesn't even give a fuck that Alex believes

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him, screaming at him on the hurricane day, and now with like, oh, hey, let's double down

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on fucking Sandy Hook, and I'm going to fucking talk to David Knight about how you're a coward

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because you got intimidated out of Sandy Hook truth.

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Pretty hilarious.

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I think the entire operation in that sense has deteriorated.

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I don't think it matters anymore.

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They did the job that needed to be done.

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Now Alex is still fighting like a guy behind enemy lines who doesn't know the war has ended.

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He is a guy who's still on Team Trump because he's changed friends, and now his friends

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are these trolls.

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His friends are the Mike Cernovitches.

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Friends are Jack Passobiac.

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These people who, they aren't ideological.

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They're not smart.

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They're not strategic in the same way that Roger Stone, Steve Paczentk, to some extent

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Larry Nichols are.

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Alex is just, he's in a new ocean now, but it's the same ocean in as much as he has the

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same boat.

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The boat is what Roger Stone gave him earlier, and that is the Trump boat, and it's a lie.

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That metaphor fell apart.

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It didn't go well at the end.

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You had a great, great jump.

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You dove perfectly, and then you did a belly flop at the end there.

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You executed-

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In the air.

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Amazing.

Unknown Speaker (02:47:46.719)

Oh.

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Landing terrible.

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Not great.

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Yeah.

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Not great.

Unknown Speaker (02:47:51.719)

I mean, it's just, we have such a cast of characters who all seem pathetic whenever

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you reveal all of this stuff about them.

Unknown Speaker (02:48:02.479)

True.

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And it's hard-

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They are.

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Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (02:48:06.479)

They're not not.

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No.

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And it's just, because you put out a compelling argument, you really do.

Unknown Speaker (02:48:13.239)

I have no real like, oh, well, I can put a little hole in this here and a little hole

Unknown Speaker (02:48:19.239)

in this there that would deflate your balloon entirely.

Unknown Speaker (02:48:23.399)

I think there are some places where maybe you've gone a step too far or not, but that

Unknown Speaker (02:48:29.620)

is, that is part of the game.

Unknown Speaker (02:48:31.600)

Sure.

Unknown Speaker (02:48:32.600)

I just have-

Unknown Speaker (02:48:33.600)

World War Games.

Unknown Speaker (02:48:34.600)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (02:48:35.600)

I just have a hard, like aversion to accepting that these people could actually pull it off.

Unknown Speaker (02:48:46.280)

Like it seems as though-

Unknown Speaker (02:48:47.280)

I think it's probably way easier than you're pretending.

Unknown Speaker (02:48:48.559)

I know, but it seems as though if they could pull this dumb shit off, people could pull

Unknown Speaker (02:48:53.040)

up, I don't know, maybe I'm just misreading so much of-

Unknown Speaker (02:48:56.520)

I think about a lot of the scams that have been pulled off.

Unknown Speaker (02:48:58.639)

I know, now like the more I think about it, the more I'm leaning towards what you're saying

Unknown Speaker (02:49:03.399)

is true.

Unknown Speaker (02:49:04.399)

Look at what just came about Harvey Weinstein.

Unknown Speaker (02:49:06.159)

I mean that, and what happens with tons of these really powerful dudes.

Unknown Speaker (02:49:10.840)

Like that stuff is, I mean, it is a little bit reductive and insulting to call it a scam,

Unknown Speaker (02:49:17.280)

but on some level, the serial sexual harassment of women who are your subordinates or you're

Unknown Speaker (02:49:24.440)

in a power position, that is a scam that you're pulling.

Unknown Speaker (02:49:28.200)

It's a much more personal scam, but it is, and the cover up of it is another scam, and

Unknown Speaker (02:49:36.040)

that happens all the time.

Unknown Speaker (02:49:37.479)

I think-

Unknown Speaker (02:49:38.479)

The idea that those people aren't really that smart, Harvey Weinstein isn't that smart,

Unknown Speaker (02:49:43.840)

he's offering to masturbate in front of people.

Unknown Speaker (02:49:45.799)

Here is your-

Unknown Speaker (02:49:46.799)

You understand?

Unknown Speaker (02:49:47.799)

Here is your best defense.

Unknown Speaker (02:49:48.799)

Smart, it's smart doesn't matter.

Unknown Speaker (02:49:51.040)

Paying people who are good at covering stuff up and manipulating people is what does the

Unknown Speaker (02:49:56.920)

work.

Unknown Speaker (02:49:57.920)

The people who are behind the scenes doing the PR work are the people like Steve Pacheco,

Unknown Speaker (02:50:02.159)

like Roger Smith.

Unknown Speaker (02:50:03.159)

Here's what I got for you.

Unknown Speaker (02:50:04.159)

Here is your simplest defense.

Unknown Speaker (02:50:06.399)

When powerful people are insulated from any consequences of their action, why the fuck

Unknown Speaker (02:50:11.879)

wouldn't they do it?

Unknown Speaker (02:50:14.440)

Just like when you brought up Weinstein, that's the thought that I had.

Unknown Speaker (02:50:18.959)

If you are insulated, like even now, his worst consequence is, oh, I retire with my billions

Unknown Speaker (02:50:25.659)

of dollars.

Unknown Speaker (02:50:26.959)

Like if you're insulated from any actual consequences, why the fuck not play this game?

Unknown Speaker (02:50:32.520)

You're bored.

Unknown Speaker (02:50:34.520)

That's what it really is.

Unknown Speaker (02:50:35.520)

There are no stakes for you.

Unknown Speaker (02:50:37.239)

It's like gambling.

Unknown Speaker (02:50:38.239)

Right.

Unknown Speaker (02:50:39.239)

And that may explain some of Trump's motivations.

Unknown Speaker (02:50:43.159)

And then you go into what we already talked about, about Manafort.

Unknown Speaker (02:50:47.360)

Right.

Unknown Speaker (02:50:48.360)

Now these people need to go to jail or nothing's going to-

Unknown Speaker (02:50:51.200)

There's probably some people who are insulated from consequences and some people who are

Unknown Speaker (02:50:54.440)

desperate to avoid consequences, and they're coming together in a terrifying fashion.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:01.280)

Let's wrap this up.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:02.280)

I think that's really the ultimate point of all of this, is that whenever people are insulated

Unknown Speaker (02:51:08.459)

from consequences, who gives a fuck?

Unknown Speaker (02:51:10.879)

Perhaps.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:11.879)

Anyway, Jordan's been fun.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:13.379)

This is always fun.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:14.379)

We have rambled a long time here at the end.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:17.000)

I just love doing this podcast so fucking much.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:19.639)

It's fun, except when-

Unknown Speaker (02:51:20.639)

Even when you get angry at me, Dan.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:22.559)

And I'm sorry about that.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:23.559)

Any lesson will be great.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:27.319)

Hold on one second.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:28.319)

Let me just put Cthulhu right in front of me.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:31.500)

And now-

Unknown Speaker (02:51:32.500)

This episode's not going to be a video episode, but it's fine.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:34.680)

I know, but now we can talk.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:37.579)

So people can find us at our website, knowledgefight.com.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:40.120)

Absolutely.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:41.120)

You can also follow us on Twitter at knowledge underscore fight.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:44.280)

Yes.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:45.280)

And we're on Facebook.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:46.280)

Go to iTunes, leave a review.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:48.440)

Also, we will be, tonight, we'll be live on Twitch.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:52.559)

But thank you all for listening.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:53.559)

We appreciate it.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:54.559)

I would like to do our bit, but I've got to be honest, I've got to piss really bad.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:58.879)

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker (02:51:59.879)

No, I understand.

Unknown Speaker (02:52:00.879)

There's this guy, his name's John Rapaport.

Unknown Speaker (02:52:02.360)

He can go fuck himself.

Unknown Speaker (02:52:03.360)

What's his name?

Unknown Speaker (02:52:04.360)

He can go fuck himself.

Unknown Speaker (02:52:05.360)

Yeah, he can fuck himself.

Unknown Speaker (02:52:06.360)

Go fuck yourself, John Rapaport!

Unknown Speaker (02:52:07.360)

Andy in Kansas.

Unknown Speaker (02:52:08.360)

You're on the air.

Unknown Speaker (02:52:09.360)

Thanks for holding.

Unknown Speaker (02:52:10.360)

Hello, Alex.

Unknown Speaker (02:52:11.360)

I'm a first time caller.

Unknown Speaker (02:52:12.360)

I'm a huge fan.

Unknown Speaker (02:52:13.360)

I love your work.

Unknown Speaker (02:52:14.360)

Thank you so much.